[{"_1":2,"_3":-5,"_4":-5},"loaderData",{"_5":6,"_7":8},"actionData","errors","root",{"_141":-5,"_142":-5,"_143":144,"_145":146,"_147":148},"routes/clips.$id.$slug",{"_9":10,"_11":12},"clip",{"_13":14,"_15":16,"_17":-5,"_18":19,"_20":-5,"_21":22,"_23":24,"_25":26,"_27":28,"_29":30,"_31":32,"_33":34,"_35":36,"_37":38,"_39":40,"_41":-5,"_42":-5,"_43":-5,"_44":45,"_46":-5,"_47":48,"_49":50,"_51":-5},"canonicalUrl","https://howleaderslead.com/clips/3442/conversation-leads-to-conversion","id",3442,"title","Conversation leads to conversion","subtitle","transcript","WEBVTT\n\n1\n00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.960\ntheir blooming dales. And this elderly couple came up to me\n\n2\n00:00:02.960 --> 00:00:05.120\nbecause they saw a bunch of suits walking in the store and\n\n3\n00:00:05.120 --> 00:00:07.920\nthey figured we were important and they could share their\n\n4\n00:00:07.920 --> 00:00:11.280\nobservations. And this woman came up to me and said, you\n\n5\n00:00:11.280 --> 00:00:14.200\nknow, do you do you lead this company do something? I said,\n\n6\n00:00:14.200 --> 00:00:17.220\nOh, how can I how can it be your assistance? And she said,\n\n7\n00:00:17.220 --> 00:00:20.960\nyou know, everywhere I go in this store, people ask, how are\n\n8\n00:00:20.960 --> 00:00:24.920\nyou? Can I help you? But nobody waits for the answer. Here I\n\n9\n00:00:24.920 --> 00:00:27.440\nthought I was going to get a compliment with the everybody\n\n10\n00:00:27.440 --> 00:00:30.880\nasked, how are you? And then we asked, how are you? How are\n\n11\n00:00:30.880 --> 00:00:34.240\nyou? How are you? But nobody wanted to have a conversation.\n\n12\n00:00:34.240 --> 00:00:38.080\nAnd one of the adages that I use is conversation leads to\n\n13\n00:00:38.080 --> 00:00:41.840\nconversion. In our business, not unlike the bartender at\n\n14\n00:00:41.840 --> 00:00:46.120\ncheers, people want to have a conversation, people want to\n\n15\n00:00:46.120 --> 00:00:49.160\nshare what's going on in their life. If you get them to open\n\n16\n00:00:49.160 --> 00:00:52.360\nup, if you ask open ended questions, if you begin to get\n\n17\n00:00:52.360 --> 00:00:55.280\nto know them, you have more of an opportunity to be of service\n\n18\n00:00:55.280 --> 00:00:57.520\non what they're looking for and beyond.\n","pretty_transcript","start_time",659948,"end_time",719179,"keywords","Sales, conversation, relationships, conversion, customer service","slug","conversation-leads-to-conversion","origin","cms","mux_playback_id","sA4VuEy01WWcF00dz1bN7D4xz01o7sz4aohKYdSm702SVu4","mux_asset_id","L2eCD01tBxsC02sQSojppUHjlbAAM7UKyvVu1SKDPY02rk","leader_id",295,"episode_id",444,"updated_at","2026-08-27T15:39:26.000000Z","meta_title","meta_description","og_image_media_id","web_url","https://www.howleaderslead.com/clips/3442/conversation-leads-to-conversion","og_image_url","leader",{"_13":36,"_104":105,"_106":107,"_108":109,"_25":110,"_111":112,"_61":113,"_58":113,"_114":115,"_68":116,"_39":117,"_118":119,"_41":-5,"_42":-5,"_43":-5,"_120":121,"_91":122,"_44":123,"_124":125,"_126":127,"_46":-5,"_128":129,"_130":131,"_95":132,"_51":-5},"episode",{"_13":38,"_15":52,"_27":53,"_17":54,"_55":56,"_18":57,"_20":-5,"_58":59,"_60":-5,"_61":59,"_62":-5,"_63":64,"_65":66,"_67":-5,"_68":-5,"_69":70,"_71":72,"_73":74,"_35":36,"_39":75,"_41":-5,"_42":76,"_43":-5,"_77":78,"_79":80,"_81":82,"_83":84,"_85":-5,"_86":-5,"_87":88,"_89":90,"_91":-5,"_46":-5,"_92":93,"_94":-5,"_95":-5,"_51":-5},"og_image_media","Hit the ground listening","hit-the-ground-listening","Everyone says to “hit the ground running.” But the leaders who really transform things know how to actively listen, right from day one.","summary","

Everyone says to “hit the ground running.” Tony Spring thinks that’s terrible advice.

Tony is the Chairman and CEO of Macy’s, an iconic retail institution with over 150 years of history. He took charge in 2024 after a 35-year career moving through the ranks at sister company Bloomingdale’s. But despite knowing the organization well, he didn’t come right out with a shiny reinvention strategy.

Instead, he hit the ground listening – to customers, colleagues, data, and the culture at large.

For Tony, listening isn’t passive. It’s something you do with your whole heart and mind. And it’s the foundation of any big change, including a turnaround.

If you want to see how he does it (with plenty of memorable stories and metaphors along the way!) don’t miss this episode.

This episode is for you if:

You work in the retail or hospitality industry
You’re leading a big change or turnaround
You want to be more intentional in meetings
You’re not sure whether to kill an initiative or keep developing it

","WEBVTT\n\n1\n00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.880\n- Hello, friends, and welcome to another episode\n\n2\n00:00:02.880 --> 00:00:05.160\nof \"How Leaders Lead\" with David Novak.\n\n3\n00:00:05.160 --> 00:00:07.040\nToday, we have Tony Spring on the show.\n\n4\n00:00:07.040 --> 00:00:09.240\nHe's the chairman and CEO of Macy's,\n\n5\n00:00:09.240 --> 00:00:11.760\nand it's perfect timing because they are approaching\n\n6\n00:00:11.760 --> 00:00:16.760\ntheir 100th year of the iconic Macy's Thanksgiving day parade.\n\n7\n00:00:16.760 --> 00:00:19.920\nMacy's is a business with a storied history,\n\n8\n00:00:19.920 --> 00:00:23.040\nand it's one that we can all learn from.\n\n9\n00:00:23.040 --> 00:00:25.320\nEnjoy this conversation with David and Tony,\n\n10\n00:00:25.320 --> 00:00:28.440\nand I'll see you at the end of the episode for the debrief.\n\n11\n00:00:30.720 --> 00:00:31.560\n- Thank you.\n\n12\n00:00:31.560 --> 00:00:37.560\nI learned that your first job was at Burger King.\n\n13\n00:00:37.560 --> 00:00:40.400\nAre you still the go-to guy in the grill at your house?\n\n14\n00:00:40.400 --> 00:00:44.120\n- I am the go-to guy at the grill at my house,\n\n15\n00:00:44.120 --> 00:00:46.800\nand that was my first job.\n\n16\n00:00:46.800 --> 00:00:50.520\nWhen I was 16, I headed to Burger King with an application\n\n17\n00:00:50.520 --> 00:00:52.760\nand was lucky enough to get the job,\n\n18\n00:00:52.760 --> 00:00:55.360\nand I have a lot of leadership lessons\n\n19\n00:00:55.360 --> 00:00:57.440\nthat I got from that first experience.\n\n20\n00:00:57.440 --> 00:01:00.400\n- What would be the number one leadership lesson that you got?\n\n21\n00:01:00.400 --> 00:01:03.040\n- First, when I showed up for the first day of work,\n\n22\n00:01:03.040 --> 00:01:04.520\nthey sent me to the parking lot,\n\n23\n00:01:04.520 --> 00:01:06.600\nso I totally didn't understand the purpose\n\n24\n00:01:06.600 --> 00:01:07.960\nof the first day of work,\n\n25\n00:01:07.960 --> 00:01:09.600\nand I went and cleaned the parking lot,\n\n26\n00:01:09.600 --> 00:01:10.800\nand they explained to me,\n\n27\n00:01:10.800 --> 00:01:12.920\nthat's the customer's first impression,\n\n28\n00:01:12.920 --> 00:01:14.640\nand everyone who works at this restaurant\n\n29\n00:01:14.640 --> 00:01:18.240\nhas to understand how important and first impression is.\n\n30\n00:01:18.240 --> 00:01:19.840\nThe second thing I learned was how,\n\n31\n00:01:19.840 --> 00:01:23.080\neven though it looked like a lot of fun to work the fryer,\n\n32\n00:01:23.080 --> 00:01:26.160\nit gets very hot out of the fry station\n\n33\n00:01:26.160 --> 00:01:27.800\nas quickly as possible,\n\n34\n00:01:27.800 --> 00:01:30.200\nlearn how to work the drive-through.\n\n35\n00:01:30.200 --> 00:01:31.600\n- That's great, that's great.\n\n36\n00:01:31.600 --> 00:01:35.400\nYou get a few more quarters in your pocket, too, you know?\n\n37\n00:01:35.400 --> 00:01:37.520\nYou know, and then, as I understand it,\n\n38\n00:01:37.520 --> 00:01:41.360\nyou studied hospitality at Cornell,\n\n39\n00:01:41.360 --> 00:01:43.760\nwhich is known for that,\n\n40\n00:01:43.760 --> 00:01:45.880\nand you know, what's one lesson you learned\n\n41\n00:01:45.880 --> 00:01:48.120\nabout hospitality in college\n\n42\n00:01:48.120 --> 00:01:51.480\nthat you keep coming back to throughout your career?\n\n43\n00:01:51.480 --> 00:01:53.360\n- Yeah, I left Burger King\n\n44\n00:01:53.360 --> 00:01:57.360\nand had this passion for the hospitality industry,\n\n45\n00:01:57.360 --> 00:01:58.800\nand to your point,\n\n46\n00:01:58.800 --> 00:02:00.760\nCornell was in our family blood,\n\n47\n00:02:00.760 --> 00:02:03.440\n'cause my grandmother and my mother\n\n48\n00:02:03.440 --> 00:02:06.240\nand my children both went to Cornell,\n\n49\n00:02:06.240 --> 00:02:08.360\nso I loved the school.\n\n50\n00:02:08.360 --> 00:02:10.120\nAnd I remember a freshman year,\n\n51\n00:02:10.120 --> 00:02:12.320\nthere was a class in food chemistry,\n\n52\n00:02:12.320 --> 00:02:13.800\nand we went to a lab,\n\n53\n00:02:13.800 --> 00:02:16.640\nand every group had to make bread,\n\n54\n00:02:16.640 --> 00:02:18.720\nbut only one had the right recipe.\n\n55\n00:02:18.720 --> 00:02:21.120\nThe rest of us didn't have yeast,\n\n56\n00:02:21.120 --> 00:02:24.680\nhad too much yeast, needed it three times,\n\n57\n00:02:24.680 --> 00:02:26.280\nwas missing the right flour,\n\n58\n00:02:26.280 --> 00:02:28.680\nand the lesson and moral of the lab\n\n59\n00:02:28.680 --> 00:02:32.000\nwas ingredients and execution are important\n\n60\n00:02:32.000 --> 00:02:34.280\nto define a brand or a recipe.\n\n61\n00:02:34.280 --> 00:02:36.360\nAnd I use that brand recipe thing\n\n62\n00:02:36.360 --> 00:02:37.880\nwith our team all the time,\n\n63\n00:02:37.880 --> 00:02:41.120\nbecause all the ingredients have to be the right measure,\n\n64\n00:02:41.120 --> 00:02:43.680\nand then the execution has to be done just right.\n\n65\n00:02:43.680 --> 00:02:45.280\n- That's a great story.\n\n66\n00:02:45.280 --> 00:02:50.280\nAnd you took over as CEO of Macy's in 2024,\n\n67\n00:02:50.400 --> 00:02:54.080\nafter being in the company for over 35 years,\n\n68\n00:02:54.080 --> 00:02:59.240\nwhat job or jobs prepared you the most for the CEO role?\n\n69\n00:02:59.240 --> 00:03:00.720\n- You know, I'm a generalist now.\n\n70\n00:03:00.720 --> 00:03:02.960\nI think the CEO has the opportunity\n\n71\n00:03:02.960 --> 00:03:05.360\nto define the strategy\n\n72\n00:03:05.360 --> 00:03:07.480\nbased on what you learn from your consumer\n\n73\n00:03:07.480 --> 00:03:10.720\nand what you think the marketplace opportunity is.\n\n74\n00:03:10.720 --> 00:03:13.080\nYou obviously have to feel the team,\n\n75\n00:03:13.080 --> 00:03:14.760\nmake sure you have the right talent in the room,\n\n76\n00:03:14.760 --> 00:03:17.560\nand around the table, diverse set of skills,\n\n77\n00:03:17.560 --> 00:03:19.120\nand you have to allocate capital\n\n78\n00:03:19.120 --> 00:03:22.040\nso that you're providing a return on investment.\n\n79\n00:03:22.040 --> 00:03:24.800\nBut I really feel like having had the opportunity\n\n80\n00:03:24.800 --> 00:03:27.520\nto be a merchant, to be in marketing,\n\n81\n00:03:27.520 --> 00:03:29.360\nto work in stores,\n\n82\n00:03:29.360 --> 00:03:32.320\nto really to have exposure to all areas of the business,\n\n83\n00:03:32.320 --> 00:03:35.160\nI know enough to ask a question about anything.\n\n84\n00:03:35.160 --> 00:03:38.320\nI don't know enough to be a specialist anymore in anything.\n\n85\n00:03:38.320 --> 00:03:43.320\n- But you do know enough to know the entire business,\n\n86\n00:03:43.320 --> 00:03:45.640\nwhich is a huge advantage.\n\n87\n00:03:45.640 --> 00:03:48.720\nAnd you know, I'm wondering as you were coming up\n\n88\n00:03:48.720 --> 00:03:50.920\nin your career, you know, a lot of times\n\n89\n00:03:50.920 --> 00:03:54.360\npeople get stereotyped as one thing or another.\n\n90\n00:03:54.360 --> 00:03:56.120\nLike this is just a finance person,\n\n91\n00:03:56.120 --> 00:03:59.280\njust a marketing person, just a technology person.\n\n92\n00:03:59.280 --> 00:04:02.440\nWas there ever a time you felt like you were being unfairly\n\n93\n00:04:02.440 --> 00:04:03.560\npigeonholed?\n\n94\n00:04:03.560 --> 00:04:08.000\nAnd if so, how did you go about changing that perception?\n\n95\n00:04:08.000 --> 00:04:09.760\n- You know, quite frankly, David,\n\n96\n00:04:09.760 --> 00:04:12.360\nI was really fortunate to have some great mentors\n\n97\n00:04:12.360 --> 00:04:14.040\nand sponsors along the way\n\n98\n00:04:14.040 --> 00:04:17.200\nbecause I really thought I wanted to be a great merchant.\n\n99\n00:04:17.200 --> 00:04:21.240\nAnd merchants in retail tend to be big decision makers.\n\n100\n00:04:21.240 --> 00:04:25.040\nAnd I was so excited to be a GMM of home furnishings\n\n101\n00:04:25.040 --> 00:04:28.000\nat Bloomingdale's and one day the CEO came into my office\n\n102\n00:04:28.000 --> 00:04:30.640\nand said, I want you to run marketing.\n\n103\n00:04:30.640 --> 00:04:31.680\nI want you to move.\n\n104\n00:04:31.680 --> 00:04:33.400\nAnd I said, move, why would I move?\n\n105\n00:04:33.400 --> 00:04:34.600\nI have the best job.\n\n106\n00:04:34.600 --> 00:04:36.360\nI'm so excited.\n\n107\n00:04:36.360 --> 00:04:38.160\nHe said, I think you have the opportunity to do more\n\n108\n00:04:38.160 --> 00:04:39.360\nin the organization.\n\n109\n00:04:39.360 --> 00:04:42.080\nAnd you really need to be beyond just a merchant.\n\n110\n00:04:42.080 --> 00:04:43.440\nYou need to understand enterprise,\n\n111\n00:04:43.440 --> 00:04:45.600\nthinking you need to understand all the facets\n\n112\n00:04:45.600 --> 00:04:47.080\nthat ultimately drive our business\n\n113\n00:04:47.080 --> 00:04:48.680\nand attract our customers.\n\n114\n00:04:48.680 --> 00:04:51.400\nAnd his push made me comfortable that it was the right\n\n115\n00:04:51.400 --> 00:04:53.760\ndecision and did marketing for nine years,\n\n116\n00:04:53.760 --> 00:04:55.440\nthen moved to stores for three years,\n\n117\n00:04:55.440 --> 00:04:57.720\nthen became president for five years\n\n118\n00:04:57.720 --> 00:04:58.880\nbefore I became the CEO.\n\n119\n00:04:58.880 --> 00:05:02.360\nSo I feel like I had the perfect training ground experience\n\n120\n00:05:02.360 --> 00:05:04.760\nbecause of the people cared enough about me\n\n121\n00:05:04.760 --> 00:05:06.880\nto make sure that they showed me the ropes.\n\n122\n00:05:06.880 --> 00:05:09.440\n- And so much is changing Tony in retail.\n\n123\n00:05:09.440 --> 00:05:11.360\nI mean, it's just changing before our eyes.\n\n124\n00:05:11.360 --> 00:05:14.560\nEvery day, it's different, and you've been in the company\n\n125\n00:05:14.560 --> 00:05:17.680\nfor over three decades.\n\n126\n00:05:17.680 --> 00:05:19.480\nHow did you come in as a CEO\n\n127\n00:05:19.480 --> 00:05:24.480\nand have the necessary fresh set of eyes,\n\n128\n00:05:24.480 --> 00:05:27.560\nthe fresh eyes to look at the problem?\n\n129\n00:05:27.560 --> 00:05:30.840\n- Yeah, I looked at myself as an insider outsider.\n\n130\n00:05:30.840 --> 00:05:34.080\nSo here I had 35 years of experience at Bloomingdale's\n\n131\n00:05:34.080 --> 00:05:35.840\nand I was moving over to Macy's.\n\n132\n00:05:35.840 --> 00:05:37.800\nI'd already been involved in some\n\n133\n00:05:37.800 --> 00:05:39.480\nof the corporate strategy work.\n\n134\n00:05:39.480 --> 00:05:43.960\nWe just completed a project of talking to over 60,000 customers\n\n135\n00:05:43.960 --> 00:05:46.560\nabout how they felt about the Macy's brand,\n\n136\n00:05:46.560 --> 00:05:48.400\nand we learned what they loved,\n\n137\n00:05:48.400 --> 00:05:51.520\nand we learned an awful lot about what they were unhappy with.\n\n138\n00:05:51.520 --> 00:05:54.000\nAnd it gave me the opportunity to kind of bring\n\n139\n00:05:54.000 --> 00:05:56.120\nsome of my experience from Bloomingdale's,\n\n140\n00:05:56.120 --> 00:05:58.680\nrespect the fact that there's a different brand\n\n141\n00:05:58.680 --> 00:06:00.760\nand different customer and different business,\n\n142\n00:06:00.760 --> 00:06:03.080\nbut really answer the challenge from the consumer\n\n143\n00:06:03.080 --> 00:06:04.840\nthat we were not executing.\n\n144\n00:06:04.840 --> 00:06:07.840\nWe were not creating a story told,\n\n145\n00:06:07.840 --> 00:06:10.520\nemotional experience that she was necessarily\n\n146\n00:06:10.520 --> 00:06:12.240\ngonna convert with us from.\n\n147\n00:06:12.240 --> 00:06:15.040\nAnd so it was a great forum to use\n\n148\n00:06:15.040 --> 00:06:17.400\nand then to really pull my team together\n\n149\n00:06:17.400 --> 00:06:20.000\nand develop a strategy which we call the bold new chapter.\n\n150\n00:06:20.000 --> 00:06:22.480\nWe're now kind of two and a half years in,\n\n151\n00:06:22.480 --> 00:06:25.880\nand ultimately it's addressing the needs of the consumer\n\n152\n00:06:25.880 --> 00:06:27.760\nso that we not only have a right to play,\n\n153\n00:06:27.760 --> 00:06:29.600\nwe have an opportunity to win.\n\n154\n00:06:29.600 --> 00:06:32.600\n- You know, did you do anything as the CEO\n\n155\n00:06:32.600 --> 00:06:35.840\nto really let everybody know there's a new sheriff in town?\n\n156\n00:06:35.840 --> 00:06:38.360\nYou know, a lot of people, I remember talking to Jack Welch\n\n157\n00:06:38.360 --> 00:06:39.920\nand he talked about the importance\n\n158\n00:06:39.920 --> 00:06:43.280\nof, you know, shocking the system as a new leader.\n\n159\n00:06:43.280 --> 00:06:46.600\nIs there something that you did or not?\n\n160\n00:06:46.600 --> 00:06:48.120\n- I brought the team together\n\n161\n00:06:48.120 --> 00:06:51.320\nand I talked on a number of occasions\n\n162\n00:06:51.320 --> 00:06:52.920\nabout what my observations were.\n\n163\n00:06:52.920 --> 00:06:55.080\nI had the opportunity to be president\n\n164\n00:06:55.080 --> 00:06:57.160\nand CEO elect of the company for a year,\n\n165\n00:06:57.160 --> 00:07:00.560\nwhich is not a privilege that a lot of people get to do.\n\n166\n00:07:00.560 --> 00:07:02.960\nSo I could obviously be a decision maker\n\n167\n00:07:02.960 --> 00:07:05.240\nas well as begin to share some of the observations\n\n168\n00:07:05.240 --> 00:07:07.360\nthat I had about what had to change\n\n169\n00:07:07.360 --> 00:07:09.080\nin order for us to be successful.\n\n170\n00:07:09.080 --> 00:07:13.400\nAnd so I created a charter for our corporate strategy group,\n\n171\n00:07:13.400 --> 00:07:16.560\nwhich basically talked about the importance of candor\n\n172\n00:07:16.560 --> 00:07:20.520\nin the room, making sure that we were being direct\n\n173\n00:07:20.520 --> 00:07:24.000\nwith each other, making sure that we respected the fact\n\n174\n00:07:24.000 --> 00:07:26.160\nthat we each had a diverse background\n\n175\n00:07:26.160 --> 00:07:29.000\nand that we could bring something to the enterprise,\n\n176\n00:07:29.000 --> 00:07:31.040\nthat the enterprise decisions came first\n\n177\n00:07:31.040 --> 00:07:32.800\nbefore our functional responsibility.\n\n178\n00:07:32.800 --> 00:07:37.400\nSo there was plenty, but what I tried to do was dose it\n\n179\n00:07:37.400 --> 00:07:39.480\nso that it wasn't, you know, with a hammer,\n\n180\n00:07:39.480 --> 00:07:42.640\nit was more with the intent in trying to be instructional\n\n181\n00:07:42.640 --> 00:07:45.520\nor educational about to be successful.\n\n182\n00:07:45.520 --> 00:07:48.080\nWe had the obligation to do the following.\n\n183\n00:07:48.080 --> 00:07:50.920\n- You know, I read where you said,\n\n184\n00:07:50.920 --> 00:07:52.880\nyou told the team early on that you said,\n\n185\n00:07:52.880 --> 00:07:54.360\nwe can be proud of our history,\n\n186\n00:07:54.360 --> 00:07:57.880\nbut we can't be proud of our current performance, you know.\n\n187\n00:07:57.880 --> 00:08:01.720\nWhy do you feel that needed to be said and in that way?\n\n188\n00:08:01.720 --> 00:08:04.520\nThe history and the performance.\n\n189\n00:08:04.520 --> 00:08:06.360\n- Yeah, look, there are not a lot of brands\n\n190\n00:08:06.360 --> 00:08:09.800\nthat survive a hundred years, let alone over 150 years.\n\n191\n00:08:09.800 --> 00:08:12.960\nAnd I think there is a lot of our heritage\n\n192\n00:08:12.960 --> 00:08:15.920\nthat is our heritage, it's our family tree.\n\n193\n00:08:15.920 --> 00:08:17.840\nAnd we don't have to destroy that,\n\n194\n00:08:17.840 --> 00:08:21.960\nbut we don't have to live in 1920 or 1970 or 1990.\n\n195\n00:08:21.960 --> 00:08:24.800\nIt's 2026, we have to show up for the customer\n\n196\n00:08:24.800 --> 00:08:27.920\nthe way she, he, they shop today.\n\n197\n00:08:27.920 --> 00:08:29.640\nThat means physically and digitally,\n\n198\n00:08:29.640 --> 00:08:32.080\nthat means in the categories that buy,\n\n199\n00:08:32.080 --> 00:08:34.880\nthat means with the right number of colleagues in our store,\n\n200\n00:08:34.880 --> 00:08:37.280\nthat means with the right care and concern\n\n201\n00:08:37.280 --> 00:08:39.200\nwhen somebody goes into a fitting room,\n\n202\n00:08:39.200 --> 00:08:41.000\nwhich is an extension of our sales floor,\n\n203\n00:08:41.000 --> 00:08:43.800\nsomeone takes their clothes off inside our store\n\n204\n00:08:43.800 --> 00:08:45.440\nand we're not taking care of them.\n\n205\n00:08:45.440 --> 00:08:48.280\nSo there's just, I thought common courtesy\n\n206\n00:08:48.280 --> 00:08:51.240\nand opportunities for us to modernize\n\n207\n00:08:51.240 --> 00:08:52.960\nthe way we approach the business.\n\n208\n00:08:52.960 --> 00:08:55.680\nAnd if we wanted to keep executing like we had\n\n209\n00:08:55.680 --> 00:08:56.640\nfive years earlier,\n\n210\n00:08:56.640 --> 00:08:59.120\nthen we didn't deserve any different business result.\n\n211\n00:08:59.120 --> 00:09:02.200\nYou know, the first job of any leader\n\n212\n00:09:02.200 --> 00:09:04.400\nand maybe the most important job every year\n\n213\n00:09:04.400 --> 00:09:06.800\nis to just keep defining the reality that you see\n\n214\n00:09:06.800 --> 00:09:09.480\nfrom your customer's perspective.\n\n215\n00:09:09.480 --> 00:09:13.720\nYou know, when you came in into Macy's,\n\n216\n00:09:13.720 --> 00:09:15.520\nyou know, what did you see?\n\n217\n00:09:15.520 --> 00:09:18.160\nHow did you define the reality for your team?\n\n218\n00:09:18.160 --> 00:09:21.600\n- Well, again, I had the benefit of 60,000 consumers\n\n219\n00:09:21.600 --> 00:09:24.160\nwith me to say, we love the brand,\n\n220\n00:09:24.160 --> 00:09:25.880\nwe don't love the experience.\n\n221\n00:09:25.880 --> 00:09:30.600\nThe stores were messy, the brand architecture assortment\n\n222\n00:09:30.600 --> 00:09:31.800\nwas not relevant enough.\n\n223\n00:09:31.800 --> 00:09:35.080\nThere was too much redundancy, not enough variety.\n\n224\n00:09:35.080 --> 00:09:37.680\nThere were not enough people on the floor.\n\n225\n00:09:37.680 --> 00:09:39.840\nThere was not help in the fitting room.\n\n226\n00:09:39.840 --> 00:09:41.560\nThere was not enough storytelling\n\n227\n00:09:41.560 --> 00:09:43.360\nfrom the visual display standpoint.\n\n228\n00:09:43.360 --> 00:09:45.760\nThere weren't enough events in our stores.\n\n229\n00:09:45.760 --> 00:09:48.600\nWhat did it take to have some animation during prom season?\n\n230\n00:09:48.600 --> 00:09:50.920\nWhat did it take to make it feel like Christmas\n\n231\n00:09:50.920 --> 00:09:52.080\nduring the holiday season?\n\n232\n00:09:52.080 --> 00:09:55.320\nSo I used all of the customer feedback.\n\n233\n00:09:55.320 --> 00:09:57.640\nI used all of the information that I had\n\n234\n00:09:57.640 --> 00:09:59.680\nfrom what was working at Bloomingdale's\n\n235\n00:09:59.680 --> 00:10:02.560\nand said, this is not complicated.\n\n236\n00:10:02.560 --> 00:10:03.760\nIt will take time.\n\n237\n00:10:03.760 --> 00:10:05.240\nWe have to do it together.\n\n238\n00:10:05.240 --> 00:10:07.920\nWe have to touch every aspect of the business.\n\n239\n00:10:07.920 --> 00:10:10.120\nThis is not where merchandise goes alone.\n\n240\n00:10:10.120 --> 00:10:11.720\nMarketing doesn't have to do their part.\n\n241\n00:10:11.720 --> 00:10:13.320\nStores don't have to do their part.\n\n242\n00:10:13.320 --> 00:10:15.040\nWe had to reskin the digital business\n\n243\n00:10:15.040 --> 00:10:17.800\nto make it not just a transactional business,\n\n244\n00:10:17.800 --> 00:10:20.880\nbut also the face and the first point of contact\n\n245\n00:10:20.880 --> 00:10:22.360\nfor our brand and our business.\n\n246\n00:10:22.360 --> 00:10:24.960\nSo it was a multi-prong approach.\n\n247\n00:10:24.960 --> 00:10:27.840\nAnd again, I felt the team that we had assembled\n\n248\n00:10:27.840 --> 00:10:29.080\nwas up for the challenge.\n\n249\n00:10:29.080 --> 00:10:31.240\nAnd two and a half years into the strategy,\n\n250\n00:10:31.240 --> 00:10:33.480\nI'm really pleased with the progress we're making.\n\n251\n00:10:33.480 --> 00:10:34.600\n- Yeah, that's fantastic.\n\n252\n00:10:34.600 --> 00:10:38.640\nAnd when you think about that customer feedback you got,\n\n253\n00:10:38.640 --> 00:10:41.000\nwas, I remember going out and talking to customers,\n\n254\n00:10:41.000 --> 00:10:43.280\nsometimes you just get a gut punch.\n\n255\n00:10:43.280 --> 00:10:45.520\nWas there anything that a customer ever said to you\n\n256\n00:10:45.520 --> 00:10:48.960\njust said, man, this is just something that kills me.\n\n257\n00:10:48.960 --> 00:10:52.120\nAnd this is something that teams really got to respond to.\n\n258\n00:10:52.120 --> 00:10:54.600\nSo I have to go back to my Bloomingdale's days\n\n259\n00:10:54.600 --> 00:10:56.360\nbecause I love this story and I've used it\n\n260\n00:10:56.360 --> 00:10:58.480\nwith the Macy's team as well.\n\n261\n00:10:58.480 --> 00:11:00.960\nWhen I was running marketing, I was on a visit\n\n262\n00:11:00.960 --> 00:11:03.000\nin one of our stores at Bloomingdale's.\n\n263\n00:11:03.000 --> 00:11:04.880\nAnd this elderly couple came up to me\n\n264\n00:11:04.880 --> 00:11:06.960\nbecause they saw a bunch of suits walking in the store\n\n265\n00:11:06.960 --> 00:11:08.440\nand they figured we were important\n\n266\n00:11:08.440 --> 00:11:11.120\nand they could share their observations.\n\n267\n00:11:11.120 --> 00:11:13.120\nAnd this woman came up to me and said,\n\n268\n00:11:13.120 --> 00:11:15.840\nyou know, do you lead this company, do something?\n\n269\n00:11:15.840 --> 00:11:18.360\nI said, oh, how can I, how can it be of assistance?\n\n270\n00:11:18.360 --> 00:11:21.360\nAnd she said, you know, everywhere I go in this store,\n\n271\n00:11:21.360 --> 00:11:23.280\npeople ask, how are you?\n\n272\n00:11:23.280 --> 00:11:24.280\nCan I help you?\n\n273\n00:11:24.280 --> 00:11:26.520\nBut nobody waits for the answer.\n\n274\n00:11:26.520 --> 00:11:28.920\nHere I thought I was gonna get a compliment with the,\n\n275\n00:11:28.920 --> 00:11:30.520\neverybody asks, how are you?\n\n276\n00:11:30.520 --> 00:11:32.360\nAnd then we asked, how are you?\n\n277\n00:11:32.360 --> 00:11:33.200\nHow are you?\n\n278\n00:11:33.200 --> 00:11:34.040\nHow are you?\n\n279\n00:11:34.040 --> 00:11:36.680\nBut nobody wanted to have a conversation.\n\n280\n00:11:36.680 --> 00:11:38.480\nAnd one of the adages that I use\n\n281\n00:11:38.480 --> 00:11:41.000\nis conversation leads to conversion.\n\n282\n00:11:41.000 --> 00:11:44.800\nIn our business, not unlike the bartender at Cheers,\n\n283\n00:11:44.800 --> 00:11:47.360\npeople want to have a conversation.\n\n284\n00:11:47.360 --> 00:11:49.880\nPeople wanna share what's going on in their life.\n\n285\n00:11:49.880 --> 00:11:51.280\nIf you get them to open up,\n\n286\n00:11:51.280 --> 00:11:53.200\nif you ask open ended questions,\n\n287\n00:11:53.200 --> 00:11:55.000\nif you begin to get to know them,\n\n288\n00:11:55.000 --> 00:11:57.160\nyou have more of an opportunity to be of service\n\n289\n00:11:57.160 --> 00:11:59.960\non what they're looking for and beyond.\n\n290\n00:11:59.960 --> 00:12:01.280\n- You know, Tony, I think, you know,\n\n291\n00:12:01.280 --> 00:12:03.320\nit's really important to do what you did,\n\n292\n00:12:03.320 --> 00:12:06.720\nwhich is basically define reality from the customer view.\n\n293\n00:12:06.720 --> 00:12:07.760\nBut it was pretty grim.\n\n294\n00:12:07.760 --> 00:12:08.680\nYou know, there are a lot of things\n\n295\n00:12:08.680 --> 00:12:10.440\nyou had to really take action on.\n\n296\n00:12:10.440 --> 00:12:12.760\nHow did you turn the corner and give your team\n\n297\n00:12:12.760 --> 00:12:16.440\nthe optimism they needed to really give them the sense\n\n298\n00:12:16.440 --> 00:12:18.440\nthat we can win if we do the right things,\n\n299\n00:12:18.440 --> 00:12:20.120\ntake the right actions?\n\n300\n00:12:20.120 --> 00:12:22.920\n- Yeah, I'm a big believer, David, in the two truths.\n\n301\n00:12:22.920 --> 00:12:25.960\nAnd I know you talk about self-awareness and ambition\n\n302\n00:12:25.960 --> 00:12:27.440\nand you have to see things as they are\n\n303\n00:12:27.440 --> 00:12:30.160\nbefore you can see them as you want them to be.\n\n304\n00:12:30.160 --> 00:12:32.360\nI don't believe hope is a strategy,\n\n305\n00:12:32.360 --> 00:12:35.080\nbut I do believe hope has psychic reward.\n\n306\n00:12:35.080 --> 00:12:37.880\nAnd how you give people a sense of possibilities,\n\n307\n00:12:37.880 --> 00:12:41.360\nhow you paint a picture, how you tell a story.\n\n308\n00:12:41.360 --> 00:12:43.400\nWe do a podcast inside the company\n\n309\n00:12:43.400 --> 00:12:44.800\nthat I do to all of our colleagues\n\n310\n00:12:44.800 --> 00:12:47.240\nto try to talk about analogies,\n\n311\n00:12:47.240 --> 00:12:49.720\nthings that can be teachable moments,\n\n312\n00:12:49.720 --> 00:12:51.880\nopportunities to think beyond today\n\n313\n00:12:51.880 --> 00:12:54.280\nto get them excited about what's possible.\n\n314\n00:12:54.280 --> 00:12:56.440\nAnd the wonderful thing about success,\n\n315\n00:12:56.440 --> 00:12:58.360\nsuccess can beget success.\n\n316\n00:12:58.360 --> 00:13:00.120\nAnd we have some quick wins.\n\n317\n00:13:00.120 --> 00:13:01.280\nWe need to celebrate them.\n\n318\n00:13:01.280 --> 00:13:05.080\nWe need to share them so that people see what is possible.\n\n319\n00:13:05.080 --> 00:13:07.360\nAnd again, you don't over promise in the beginning.\n\n320\n00:13:07.360 --> 00:13:09.200\nYou really have to make sure people know\n\n321\n00:13:09.200 --> 00:13:12.040\nthere's work involved to get us to the place we want to be.\n\n322\n00:13:12.040 --> 00:13:14.080\nThe retail business is definitely a journey,\n\n323\n00:13:14.080 --> 00:13:15.240\nnot a destination.\n\n324\n00:13:15.240 --> 00:13:17.800\nSo we're in a continuous improvement mode,\n\n325\n00:13:17.800 --> 00:13:20.840\nbut we can stop for a moment and celebrate those things\n\n326\n00:13:20.840 --> 00:13:22.840\nwhere we've made meaningful progress,\n\n327\n00:13:22.840 --> 00:13:24.080\nrecognize those things,\n\n328\n00:13:24.080 --> 00:13:26.880\nand encourage people to keep taking those steps.\n\n329\n00:13:26.880 --> 00:13:29.640\n- How do you celebrate those first downs?\n\n330\n00:13:29.640 --> 00:13:32.680\nWhat's your mode of recognition?\n\n331\n00:13:32.680 --> 00:13:36.600\n- Well, we reintroduced recognition inside of our stores\n\n332\n00:13:36.600 --> 00:13:38.920\nand a quarterly hospitality program.\n\n333\n00:13:38.920 --> 00:13:41.360\nYou know, we've really embraced hospitality\n\n334\n00:13:41.360 --> 00:13:44.120\nas a part of our culture at Macy's.\n\n335\n00:13:44.120 --> 00:13:47.320\nAnd so now we do quarterly recognition inside of our stores.\n\n336\n00:13:47.320 --> 00:13:51.240\nWe reintroduced in-person annual recognition.\n\n337\n00:13:51.240 --> 00:13:54.240\nWe're taking a moment in a theater environment\n\n338\n00:13:54.240 --> 00:13:56.000\nto really like the Oscars,\n\n339\n00:13:56.000 --> 00:14:00.280\ncelebrate people who do distinctive work for the customer,\n\n340\n00:14:00.280 --> 00:14:01.400\nfor the brand.\n\n341\n00:14:01.400 --> 00:14:04.360\nI read letters that I get from customers,\n\n342\n00:14:04.360 --> 00:14:06.200\nboth the things that we do well.\n\n343\n00:14:06.200 --> 00:14:09.320\nAnd I'm a big fan of the lemonade out of lemons.\n\n344\n00:14:09.320 --> 00:14:11.400\nThings that we did not get right,\n\n345\n00:14:11.400 --> 00:14:15.000\nbut boy, how wonderfully we handled the fumble.\n\n346\n00:14:15.000 --> 00:14:17.760\n- Tony, you've mentioned it a few times already.\n\n347\n00:14:17.760 --> 00:14:19.040\nYou're a big storyteller.\n\n348\n00:14:19.040 --> 00:14:22.080\nI mean, you like to tell stories.\n\n349\n00:14:22.080 --> 00:14:23.440\n- I learned that way.\n\n350\n00:14:23.440 --> 00:14:27.320\n- Yeah, okay, well, tell us what's behind your thinking\n\n351\n00:14:27.320 --> 00:14:30.000\non the stories and how you use them.\n\n352\n00:14:30.000 --> 00:14:35.000\n- I try to take subjects sometimes that seem dry, mundane,\n\n353\n00:14:35.000 --> 00:14:39.320\nsometimes can be monotonous, sometimes can be repetitive.\n\n354\n00:14:39.320 --> 00:14:41.640\nAnd I try to spice it up and make sure\n\n355\n00:14:41.640 --> 00:14:44.360\nthat I'm drawing cultural moments,\n\n356\n00:14:44.360 --> 00:14:47.320\nanalogies, relationships with people,\n\n357\n00:14:47.320 --> 00:14:51.680\ncars, food, whatever people live in their everyday life,\n\n358\n00:14:51.680 --> 00:14:54.640\nsometimes is an easier leadership lesson\n\n359\n00:14:54.640 --> 00:14:57.240\nthan listening to the CEO go on and on\n\n360\n00:14:57.240 --> 00:15:00.440\nabout our service standard inside the store.\n\n361\n00:15:00.440 --> 00:15:04.240\nI'd rather say, when somebody comes to your home,\n\n362\n00:15:04.240 --> 00:15:06.840\ndo you make them open the door themselves?\n\n363\n00:15:06.840 --> 00:15:08.600\nOr do you go open the door?\n\n364\n00:15:08.600 --> 00:15:11.200\nIs there clothes on the floor or do you try to clean up?\n\n365\n00:15:11.200 --> 00:15:14.240\nSo when people come into our store, which is our house,\n\n366\n00:15:14.240 --> 00:15:15.480\nhow does it feel?\n\n367\n00:15:15.480 --> 00:15:18.000\nDo you feel like you're entering in to some place\n\n368\n00:15:18.000 --> 00:15:19.480\nthat you're looking to enjoy,\n\n369\n00:15:19.480 --> 00:15:21.320\nwhere people respect that you're there,\n\n370\n00:15:21.320 --> 00:15:23.880\nthat we're excited to welcome you into the party,\n\n371\n00:15:23.880 --> 00:15:26.120\nthat you're a part of what's taking place?\n\n372\n00:15:26.120 --> 00:15:27.960\nI mean, this business is fun.\n\n373\n00:15:27.960 --> 00:15:29.280\nIt's an emotional business.\n\n374\n00:15:29.280 --> 00:15:30.680\nWe're selling things that,\n\n375\n00:15:30.680 --> 00:15:32.360\nI mean, my people don't want me to say this,\n\n376\n00:15:32.360 --> 00:15:34.320\nyou don't need all the things we sell.\n\n377\n00:15:34.320 --> 00:15:36.800\nSo we create wants out of what we're selling.\n\n378\n00:15:36.800 --> 00:15:38.840\nIt's an emotional connection.\n\n379\n00:15:38.840 --> 00:15:40.480\nIt's the storytelling.\n\n380\n00:15:40.480 --> 00:15:41.920\nYou smell a fragrance and you go,\n\n381\n00:15:41.920 --> 00:15:45.440\n\"Oh my God, I feel like I'm in Capri, I've got to buy it.\"\n\n382\n00:15:45.440 --> 00:15:47.600\nYou look at a diamond bracelet.\n\n383\n00:15:47.600 --> 00:15:50.920\nI think I can make somebody feel like a million bucks\n\n384\n00:15:50.920 --> 00:15:53.040\nby giving them something they've never had before.\n\n385\n00:15:53.040 --> 00:15:54.880\nSo what a great business to be in,\n\n386\n00:15:54.880 --> 00:15:57.480\nwhere we're helping people get compliments,\n\n387\n00:15:57.480 --> 00:15:59.120\nwe're helping people fall in love,\n\n388\n00:15:59.120 --> 00:16:02.480\nwe're helping people get their first job,\n\n389\n00:16:02.480 --> 00:16:05.880\ngo to the prom, have a great sweet 16.\n\n390\n00:16:05.880 --> 00:16:08.760\nEvery time I think we forget that we are actually\n\n391\n00:16:08.760 --> 00:16:11.840\nin a business about creating relationships and moments,\n\n392\n00:16:11.840 --> 00:16:14.200\nwe start to get into the transaction business,\n\n393\n00:16:14.200 --> 00:16:16.840\nwhere frankly, I don't think we can win long-term.\n\n394\n00:16:16.840 --> 00:16:19.720\nRelationship business, emotional business,\n\n395\n00:16:19.720 --> 00:16:22.880\nmoments business, I think we can do best.\n\n396\n00:16:22.880 --> 00:16:25.400\n- I know that for a fact that you're a big believer\n\n397\n00:16:25.400 --> 00:16:28.720\nthat it's a lot of times it's a soft stuff\n\n398\n00:16:28.720 --> 00:16:30.920\nthat really drives hard results.\n\n399\n00:16:30.920 --> 00:16:34.040\nHow do you think about this soft stuff?\n\n400\n00:16:34.040 --> 00:16:37.120\nAnd in particular, you talk a lot about graciousness\n\n401\n00:16:37.120 --> 00:16:42.040\nand kindness, explain how you think about that.\n\n402\n00:16:42.040 --> 00:16:43.480\n- They don't cost any money.\n\n403\n00:16:43.480 --> 00:16:46.920\nLast time I checked, you don't have to pay for graciousness,\n\n404\n00:16:46.920 --> 00:16:49.920\nyou don't have to pay for kindness, it's a human trait.\n\n405\n00:16:49.920 --> 00:16:52.280\nAnd we actually all start out that way.\n\n406\n00:16:52.280 --> 00:16:55.920\nTrying to be hospitable, trying to be generous,\n\n407\n00:16:55.920 --> 00:16:59.440\ntrying to showcase our manners and treat people\n\n408\n00:16:59.440 --> 00:17:02.880\nas they want to be treated, not as we want to offer\n\n409\n00:17:02.880 --> 00:17:04.040\nor we think.\n\n410\n00:17:04.040 --> 00:17:06.800\nSo it's thinking like the consumer.\n\n411\n00:17:06.800 --> 00:17:10.680\nAnd I think it's going the slight extra mile.\n\n412\n00:17:10.680 --> 00:17:13.360\nI mean, walking someone's packages to their car,\n\n413\n00:17:13.360 --> 00:17:16.360\nholding the door, coming from behind the register\n\n414\n00:17:16.360 --> 00:17:18.400\nand handing the bag to the consumer,\n\n415\n00:17:18.400 --> 00:17:19.840\ncalling the customer by name\n\n416\n00:17:19.840 --> 00:17:21.840\n'cause you have their credit card in your hand.\n\n417\n00:17:21.840 --> 00:17:25.040\nI mean, the simplest of things make people smile.\n\n418\n00:17:25.040 --> 00:17:27.760\nAnd I know, I'm sure like you, you go into a restaurant,\n\n419\n00:17:27.760 --> 00:17:32.000\nif the waiter waitress refills your coffee and it's hot,\n\n420\n00:17:32.000 --> 00:17:33.600\nit makes you feel a certain way\n\n421\n00:17:33.600 --> 00:17:35.520\nversus you're having to flag somebody down\n\n422\n00:17:35.520 --> 00:17:36.680\nto get a refill.\n\n423\n00:17:36.680 --> 00:17:39.160\nIf you have to wait an extra 10 minutes for the check.\n\n424\n00:17:39.160 --> 00:17:40.800\nSo kind of back to storytelling,\n\n425\n00:17:40.800 --> 00:17:44.240\nI try to bring as many practical real life examples\n\n426\n00:17:44.240 --> 00:17:47.160\nof what actually gets in the way of hospitable service\n\n427\n00:17:47.160 --> 00:17:49.400\nand what actually brings it to life\n\n428\n00:17:49.400 --> 00:17:51.320\nwhere people's eyes light up\n\n429\n00:17:51.320 --> 00:17:54.240\nand they say almost anything is possible.\n\n430\n00:17:54.240 --> 00:17:56.840\nAnd I do believe David and the soft stuff\n\n431\n00:17:56.840 --> 00:17:59.360\nbecause I think it compliments the hard stuff.\n\n432\n00:17:59.360 --> 00:18:01.800\nWe still have to deliver our financial results.\n\n433\n00:18:01.800 --> 00:18:05.400\nWe still have quarterly expectations or a public company.\n\n434\n00:18:05.400 --> 00:18:08.520\nBut I think there are times where we waive the report card\n\n435\n00:18:08.520 --> 00:18:10.000\nand we say that's the strategy.\n\n436\n00:18:10.000 --> 00:18:12.600\nAnd I have to remind people that is the report card.\n\n437\n00:18:12.600 --> 00:18:16.040\nThe strategy and the execution gets to the report card,\n\n438\n00:18:16.040 --> 00:18:17.640\nnot the other way around.\n\n439\n00:18:17.640 --> 00:18:20.360\n- You know, you're obviously a very charismatic guy,\n\n440\n00:18:20.360 --> 00:18:22.920\nyou're friendly, you know, you're engaging.\n\n441\n00:18:22.920 --> 00:18:25.560\nYou know, but you're still the CEO.\n\n442\n00:18:25.560 --> 00:18:28.520\nAnd you know, CEOs scare the hell out of people.\n\n443\n00:18:28.520 --> 00:18:32.160\nDo you have a story that you tell to let people know\n\n444\n00:18:32.160 --> 00:18:34.520\nthat you're just, you know, you might have the big job,\n\n445\n00:18:34.520 --> 00:18:36.880\nbut you're just like everybody else?\n\n446\n00:18:36.880 --> 00:18:39.000\n- Well, I try to be humble.\n\n447\n00:18:39.000 --> 00:18:41.240\nYou know, again, I learned a long time ago,\n\n448\n00:18:41.240 --> 00:18:44.920\nhumility is not the absence of confidence or confidence.\n\n449\n00:18:44.920 --> 00:18:47.560\nBut to call me by my first name,\n\n450\n00:18:47.560 --> 00:18:50.280\nto see that I can wear jeans,\n\n451\n00:18:50.280 --> 00:18:54.320\nto talk to people about their lives and their families,\n\n452\n00:18:54.320 --> 00:18:56.200\nto acknowledge when something special\n\n453\n00:18:56.200 --> 00:18:58.720\nor something terrible happens in their lives.\n\n454\n00:18:58.720 --> 00:19:00.400\nI mean, we are a big family.\n\n455\n00:19:00.400 --> 00:19:02.560\nI mean, that is the nature of our businesses.\n\n456\n00:19:02.560 --> 00:19:04.280\nWe spend a lot of time together.\n\n457\n00:19:04.280 --> 00:19:06.200\nWe do a lot of work together,\n\n458\n00:19:06.200 --> 00:19:07.960\nbut we actually care about each other.\n\n459\n00:19:07.960 --> 00:19:08.960\nAnd if we do that,\n\n460\n00:19:08.960 --> 00:19:11.920\nthen we're gonna care even more about the consumer.\n\n461\n00:19:11.920 --> 00:19:14.400\nSo when I was starting out,\n\n462\n00:19:14.400 --> 00:19:16.400\nI was gonna outwork everybody.\n\n463\n00:19:16.400 --> 00:19:19.640\nI was gonna put my head down and just get stuff done.\n\n464\n00:19:19.640 --> 00:19:22.160\nAnd I remember a boss at the time saying to me,\n\n465\n00:19:22.160 --> 00:19:24.120\nyou know, people can't see your heart.\n\n466\n00:19:24.120 --> 00:19:25.840\nYou know, they can see your shirt,\n\n467\n00:19:25.840 --> 00:19:28.160\nthey can see your jacket, they can see your glasses,\n\n468\n00:19:28.160 --> 00:19:29.920\nonly you can show them your heart.\n\n469\n00:19:29.920 --> 00:19:32.720\nAnd so it was just a good reminder to me,\n\n470\n00:19:32.720 --> 00:19:37.480\nsmiling, laughing, sharing some stories,\n\n471\n00:19:37.480 --> 00:19:41.080\nbeing interested about what their lives are all about\n\n472\n00:19:41.080 --> 00:19:43.560\nis the smallest and simplest thing I can do\n\n473\n00:19:43.560 --> 00:19:45.400\nand can make the biggest difference\n\n474\n00:19:45.400 --> 00:19:46.920\nin how people feel at work.\n\n475\n00:19:46.920 --> 00:19:49.720\n- And here you are, you know, now CO,\n\n476\n00:19:49.720 --> 00:19:52.360\nyou're over two years into this journey\n\n477\n00:19:52.360 --> 00:19:54.080\nthat you have with your team.\n\n478\n00:19:54.080 --> 00:19:56.640\nYou know, what signs of evidence\n\n479\n00:19:56.640 --> 00:19:59.440\nare you getting that the culture you're trying to drive\n\n480\n00:19:59.440 --> 00:20:02.160\nis really starting to take hold?\n\n481\n00:20:02.160 --> 00:20:03.840\n- Yeah, we have multiple measures.\n\n482\n00:20:03.840 --> 00:20:06.160\nOne was our customer service scores\n\n483\n00:20:06.160 --> 00:20:07.720\nare going up significantly.\n\n484\n00:20:07.720 --> 00:20:10.600\nOur net promoter scores have gone up every quarter\n\n485\n00:20:10.600 --> 00:20:12.280\nfor the last two and a half years.\n\n486\n00:20:12.280 --> 00:20:13.840\nWe're at a record high\n\n487\n00:20:13.840 --> 00:20:17.440\nat the Macy's, Bloomingdale's and Blue Mercury brands.\n\n488\n00:20:17.440 --> 00:20:19.920\nWe are seeing our culture poll survey,\n\n489\n00:20:19.920 --> 00:20:21.800\nwhich is a survey that we have,\n\n490\n00:20:21.800 --> 00:20:25.600\nour colleagues take over 70% of our colleagues participate in it.\n\n491\n00:20:25.600 --> 00:20:29.760\nIt's over 60, some thousand people responding.\n\n492\n00:20:29.760 --> 00:20:32.000\nThey feel better about the future of the company.\n\n493\n00:20:32.000 --> 00:20:34.160\nThey feel better about the people they work with.\n\n494\n00:20:34.160 --> 00:20:36.640\nSo we are trying to use measures\n\n495\n00:20:36.640 --> 00:20:38.440\nto then decide what tactics,\n\n496\n00:20:38.440 --> 00:20:42.000\nwhat strategies to put in place to improve the experience.\n\n497\n00:20:42.000 --> 00:20:43.360\n'Cause the customer service score\n\n498\n00:20:43.360 --> 00:20:45.280\nor net promoter score is a number.\n\n499\n00:20:45.280 --> 00:20:47.260\nIt doesn't say what to do.\n\n500\n00:20:47.260 --> 00:20:49.560\nIt says what grade the consumer is giving us,\n\n501\n00:20:49.560 --> 00:20:51.240\nwould they recommend us to a friend?\n\n502\n00:20:51.240 --> 00:20:52.200\nThen we have to say,\n\n503\n00:20:52.200 --> 00:20:54.880\nwell, we're still not getting the score we want on storytelling.\n\n504\n00:20:54.880 --> 00:20:57.000\nWe're still not delivering the service experience\n\n505\n00:20:57.000 --> 00:21:00.000\nwe think is appropriate in the restaurant, in the fitting room.\n\n506\n00:21:00.000 --> 00:21:03.360\nWe still feel like we're out of size and color too frequently\n\n507\n00:21:03.360 --> 00:21:05.000\nand we correct those things.\n\n508\n00:21:05.000 --> 00:21:07.280\nAnd then we see the scores go up again\n\n509\n00:21:07.280 --> 00:21:11.160\nwhere our colleagues feel like it's hard to get some tasks done.\n\n510\n00:21:11.160 --> 00:21:14.520\nAnd so we introduce AI as an element\n\n511\n00:21:14.520 --> 00:21:16.800\nof how we make work easier to get done.\n\n512\n00:21:16.800 --> 00:21:19.360\nSo I keep trying to draw back to,\n\n513\n00:21:19.360 --> 00:21:20.600\nyou can do a lot of surveys.\n\n514\n00:21:20.600 --> 00:21:22.240\nIf you don't respond to them,\n\n515\n00:21:22.240 --> 00:21:24.360\nthen the colleagues or the customer loses faith\n\n516\n00:21:24.360 --> 00:21:27.400\nand ever filling out the survey in the first place.\n\n517\n00:21:27.400 --> 00:21:30.320\n- Hello friends, I hope you're loving this conversation.\n\n518\n00:21:30.320 --> 00:21:32.720\nBe sure to stay tuned to the very end of the episode.\n\n519\n00:21:32.720 --> 00:21:35.040\nAs always, David and I are going to debrief\n\n520\n00:21:35.040 --> 00:21:36.880\nsome of the concepts that he talks about\n\n521\n00:21:36.880 --> 00:21:38.120\nwith this week's guests.\n\n522\n00:21:38.120 --> 00:21:42.080\nSo stay tuned to the very end and I will see you soon.\n\n523\n00:21:42.080 --> 00:21:44.800\n- You know, when you make a change in a system like yours,\n\n524\n00:21:44.800 --> 00:21:48.520\nwhich is huge and it affects so many people,\n\n525\n00:21:48.520 --> 00:21:51.520\nyou got to be right that you're rolling out the right stuff.\n\n526\n00:21:51.520 --> 00:21:55.400\nAnd you know, I understand you're a big fan of pilot tests.\n\n527\n00:21:55.400 --> 00:21:59.560\nYou know, give me an example of how you test something\n\n528\n00:21:59.560 --> 00:22:01.440\nbefore you roll it out.\n\n529\n00:22:01.440 --> 00:22:04.960\n- So in our reimagined store program, we started with 50.\n\n530\n00:22:04.960 --> 00:22:07.320\nSo part of the announcement of the bold new chapter\n\n531\n00:22:07.320 --> 00:22:09.240\nwas we were going to reduce the number of stores\n\n532\n00:22:09.240 --> 00:22:12.120\nthat were past their prime and not fit for purpose\n\n533\n00:22:12.120 --> 00:22:15.040\nand that we were going to also invest in stores,\n\n534\n00:22:15.040 --> 00:22:18.440\nput more people back into stores to try to play out\n\n535\n00:22:18.440 --> 00:22:20.480\nagainst the survey results to say,\n\n536\n00:22:20.480 --> 00:22:22.280\nI think the customer is willing to spend more money.\n\n537\n00:22:22.280 --> 00:22:24.480\nI think the customer is willing to vote more frequently\n\n538\n00:22:24.480 --> 00:22:27.000\nfor Macy's if we deliver a better experience.\n\n539\n00:22:27.000 --> 00:22:29.040\nAnd so we started with 50 stores.\n\n540\n00:22:29.040 --> 00:22:31.920\nWe added another 75 stores to get to 125.\n\n541\n00:22:31.920 --> 00:22:33.480\nWe added another 75 stores.\n\n542\n00:22:33.480 --> 00:22:38.480\nNow we're at 260% of the stores, 75% of the business.\n\n543\n00:22:38.480 --> 00:22:41.080\nWe'll add more stores next year.\n\n544\n00:22:41.080 --> 00:22:43.760\nAnd eventually we'll have reimagined all of our stores\n\n545\n00:22:43.760 --> 00:22:45.120\nthat we're going forward with.\n\n546\n00:22:45.120 --> 00:22:48.640\nSo it didn't start with we have to do it only one way.\n\n547\n00:22:48.640 --> 00:22:50.280\nWe iterated along the way.\n\n548\n00:22:50.280 --> 00:22:52.720\nSo we eliminated some things from the first 50\n\n549\n00:22:52.720 --> 00:22:56.240\nto the next 75 and then finally to the 200.\n\n550\n00:22:56.240 --> 00:23:00.720\nOne of my favorite pieces from the puzzle or the recipe\n\n551\n00:23:00.720 --> 00:23:04.280\nis that we added empowerment to the last group of stores,\n\n552\n00:23:04.280 --> 00:23:07.640\nwhich we did not frankly have in the first 50 stores.\n\n553\n00:23:07.640 --> 00:23:11.640\nAnd the example I would give is we feel like centrally\n\n554\n00:23:11.640 --> 00:23:14.680\nwe can direct everything and we can prescribe\n\n555\n00:23:14.680 --> 00:23:15.560\nhow to spend money.\n\n556\n00:23:15.560 --> 00:23:19.240\nWe can prescribe how to present things ideally from New York.\n\n557\n00:23:19.240 --> 00:23:23.160\nThe reality is we can probably get 70, 75% of it right.\n\n558\n00:23:23.160 --> 00:23:26.320\nThe last 25% is what makes you locally relevant,\n\n559\n00:23:26.320 --> 00:23:29.080\nwhat empowers people to feel like they can move resources\n\n560\n00:23:29.080 --> 00:23:30.680\naround to make a difference.\n\n561\n00:23:30.680 --> 00:23:33.600\nAnd lo and behold, that addition of empowerment\n\n562\n00:23:33.600 --> 00:23:36.560\nhas added another layer of value to the equation.\n\n563\n00:23:36.560 --> 00:23:38.040\n- I got to ask you this one.\n\n564\n00:23:38.040 --> 00:23:40.520\nCan you tell me about an idea that you really believed in\n\n565\n00:23:40.520 --> 00:23:43.440\nwith all the passion that you obviously have\n\n566\n00:23:43.440 --> 00:23:45.960\nthat didn't survive the pilot?\n\n567\n00:23:45.960 --> 00:23:48.320\n- The one that stands out to me is the rental business\n\n568\n00:23:48.320 --> 00:23:51.480\nthat I tried at Bloomingdale's based on seeing rent\n\n569\n00:23:51.480 --> 00:23:53.920\nthe runway and other people go into the business.\n\n570\n00:23:53.920 --> 00:23:56.200\nI said, God, we have all this inventory.\n\n571\n00:23:56.200 --> 00:23:57.640\nWhy don't we go into the rental business?\n\n572\n00:23:57.640 --> 00:23:58.480\nIt'd be terrific.\n\n573\n00:23:58.480 --> 00:24:01.720\nWe can get more value out of the inventory that we have\n\n574\n00:24:01.720 --> 00:24:03.160\nand it's too complicated.\n\n575\n00:24:03.160 --> 00:24:05.520\nIt was basically creating a shadow business\n\n576\n00:24:05.520 --> 00:24:07.800\nfor the business we had and a distraction\n\n577\n00:24:07.800 --> 00:24:10.480\nfor something that wasn't returning value fast enough.\n\n578\n00:24:10.480 --> 00:24:12.440\nSo we had to retire it.\n\n579\n00:24:12.440 --> 00:24:14.280\nBut I will tell you out of that pilot,\n\n580\n00:24:14.280 --> 00:24:18.160\nI coined for the team the graveyard, the garden, and the gym.\n\n581\n00:24:18.160 --> 00:24:22.240\nAnd the graveyard is where I sent the rental project.\n\n582\n00:24:22.240 --> 00:24:26.160\nThe garden is where you don't go to pick the fruit\n\n583\n00:24:26.160 --> 00:24:27.680\nafter you plant the seeds.\n\n584\n00:24:27.680 --> 00:24:29.440\nSo the things that you are piloting,\n\n585\n00:24:29.440 --> 00:24:30.760\nthe things that you're testing,\n\n586\n00:24:30.760 --> 00:24:32.960\nthey do not show results the next day.\n\n587\n00:24:32.960 --> 00:24:35.120\nAnd that's where we have to have a little bit of patience,\n\n588\n00:24:35.120 --> 00:24:38.320\na little bit of water, a little bit of tilling the soil.\n\n589\n00:24:38.320 --> 00:24:41.600\nAnd then the gym is where you got to go and work harder,\n\n590\n00:24:41.600 --> 00:24:44.520\nat least on the ideas, at least on the communication\n\n591\n00:24:44.520 --> 00:24:46.920\nbecause you obviously believe something is right,\n\n592\n00:24:46.920 --> 00:24:49.000\nbut the results don't match what you believe.\n\n593\n00:24:49.000 --> 00:24:52.120\nSo I try to use the three Gs whenever I can with the team,\n\n594\n00:24:52.120 --> 00:24:54.600\njust again to say, not everything is equal.\n\n595\n00:24:54.600 --> 00:24:56.880\nSome things are time to retire them.\n\n596\n00:24:56.880 --> 00:24:58.960\nSome things you just got started.\n\n597\n00:24:58.960 --> 00:25:00.520\nYou got to let them matriculate.\n\n598\n00:25:00.520 --> 00:25:03.600\nAnd other things require your intervention\n\n599\n00:25:03.600 --> 00:25:05.120\nto try to make them work.\n\n600\n00:25:05.120 --> 00:25:07.080\n- Is there a particular metric, Tony,\n\n601\n00:25:07.080 --> 00:25:09.400\nthat you pay attention to that most people\n\n602\n00:25:09.400 --> 00:25:12.440\nwouldn't expect to be on your radar screen?\n\n603\n00:25:12.440 --> 00:25:16.640\n- I'm known to pay attention to a lot of metrics.\n\n604\n00:25:16.640 --> 00:25:20.120\nI unfortunately keep a lot of data in front of me.\n\n605\n00:25:20.120 --> 00:25:24.720\nMainly to ask questions about why traffic, conversion,\n\n606\n00:25:24.720 --> 00:25:28.040\nIPT, average unit retail,\n\n607\n00:25:28.040 --> 00:25:30.240\nthe difference between our digital and physical business,\n\n608\n00:25:30.240 --> 00:25:32.080\nthe difference between our Florida\n\n609\n00:25:32.080 --> 00:25:33.200\nand our California business.\n\n610\n00:25:33.200 --> 00:25:36.360\nSo I am one that likes to be as informed\n\n611\n00:25:36.360 --> 00:25:38.080\nabout the business as possible.\n\n612\n00:25:38.080 --> 00:25:39.520\nAnd then I put it aside and say,\n\n613\n00:25:39.520 --> 00:25:41.280\nso what do we want to do?\n\n614\n00:25:41.280 --> 00:25:43.920\n- And how do you instill that,\n\n615\n00:25:43.920 --> 00:25:46.320\nwhat do we want to do action orientation\n\n616\n00:25:46.320 --> 00:25:47.760\ninto your organization?\n\n617\n00:25:47.760 --> 00:25:52.480\nBecause when you're big and you're a big retailer for sure,\n\n618\n00:25:52.480 --> 00:25:56.520\nyou can get hung up in a lot of bureaucracy and red tape.\n\n619\n00:25:56.520 --> 00:25:58.400\n- I think it's the questions you ask.\n\n620\n00:25:58.400 --> 00:26:01.080\nI think it's the discipline that you have around meetings.\n\n621\n00:26:01.080 --> 00:26:03.760\nI think it's the disciplines you have around agendas\n\n622\n00:26:03.760 --> 00:26:05.720\nand the time allocation to subjects.\n\n623\n00:26:05.720 --> 00:26:08.200\nSo we've gotten much better at\n\n624\n00:26:08.200 --> 00:26:09.800\nhow many topics are on the agenda?\n\n625\n00:26:09.800 --> 00:26:12.040\nHow much time are we going to spend on them?\n\n626\n00:26:12.040 --> 00:26:13.760\nWhen are we going to make a decision?\n\n627\n00:26:13.760 --> 00:26:16.120\nWho is the decision owner?\n\n628\n00:26:16.120 --> 00:26:18.600\nYou know, again, I'm not a big believer in races,\n\n629\n00:26:18.600 --> 00:26:21.480\nbut I am a big believer in meeting discipline\n\n630\n00:26:21.480 --> 00:26:22.760\nand that we should take a few minutes\n\n631\n00:26:22.760 --> 00:26:23.600\nat the end of the meeting\n\n632\n00:26:23.600 --> 00:26:26.160\nto make sure we're clear on what we've decided.\n\n633\n00:26:26.160 --> 00:26:27.960\nWe walk out of the room clear\n\n634\n00:26:27.960 --> 00:26:30.000\non what we're trying to accomplish.\n\n635\n00:26:30.000 --> 00:26:32.160\nBecause a lot of times you get a lot of nods\n\n636\n00:26:32.160 --> 00:26:33.360\nbecause people don't want to look like\n\n637\n00:26:33.360 --> 00:26:35.160\nthey don't know what they're talking about.\n\n638\n00:26:35.160 --> 00:26:38.560\nAnd they don't agree or they're not on the same page.\n\n639\n00:26:38.560 --> 00:26:40.960\nSo we have to make sure time is too precious.\n\n640\n00:26:40.960 --> 00:26:43.680\nWe're all on the same page, we'll leave the room.\n\n641\n00:26:43.680 --> 00:26:45.720\n- How do you sniff out conflict?\n\n642\n00:26:45.720 --> 00:26:48.040\n- I think that's another requirement of being a leader\n\n643\n00:26:48.040 --> 00:26:50.880\nis to suss out the person who's quiet.\n\n644\n00:26:50.880 --> 00:26:54.360\nIs to say, no, David, you haven't said much on the subject.\n\n645\n00:26:54.360 --> 00:26:56.160\nSo obviously some things on your mind.\n\n646\n00:26:56.160 --> 00:26:58.080\nPlease, you know, share it with the group.\n\n647\n00:26:58.080 --> 00:27:00.520\nThe leader has to be a facilitator.\n\n648\n00:27:00.520 --> 00:27:02.240\nAnd if you're a good facilitator,\n\n649\n00:27:02.240 --> 00:27:04.320\nyou not only hear the loudest person in the room,\n\n650\n00:27:04.320 --> 00:27:06.240\nyou also hear the person that's quiet\n\n651\n00:27:06.240 --> 00:27:07.400\nthat has something to offer\n\n652\n00:27:07.400 --> 00:27:09.400\nthat just needs to be called upon.\n\n653\n00:27:09.400 --> 00:27:11.000\n- You mentioned you had had the great fortune\n\n654\n00:27:11.000 --> 00:27:13.040\nof having some really great coaches\n\n655\n00:27:13.040 --> 00:27:15.960\nand mentors in your career.\n\n656\n00:27:15.960 --> 00:27:19.640\nWho really believed in you when you needed the most?\n\n657\n00:27:19.640 --> 00:27:22.240\n- My Gould, who was the CEO of Bloomingdale's\n\n658\n00:27:22.240 --> 00:27:26.200\nwho preceded me and was the one who gave me multiple jobs\n\n659\n00:27:26.200 --> 00:27:28.360\nin different functions and areas,\n\n660\n00:27:28.360 --> 00:27:31.680\nalways believed I had more potential than I saw in myself.\n\n661\n00:27:31.680 --> 00:27:35.960\nAnd encouraged me to use my intellectual curiosity,\n\n662\n00:27:35.960 --> 00:27:40.960\nto show my heart, to be a present with my family.\n\n663\n00:27:40.960 --> 00:27:43.640\nHe not only gave me so much,\n\n664\n00:27:43.640 --> 00:27:45.760\nbut I think he also considered, you know,\n\n665\n00:27:45.760 --> 00:27:48.160\nme someone that he could give the learnings\n\n666\n00:27:48.160 --> 00:27:50.080\nthat he had in his own life to me,\n\n667\n00:27:50.080 --> 00:27:52.040\nand wanted to make sure that I benefited\n\n668\n00:27:52.040 --> 00:27:53.840\nfrom those experiences.\n\n669\n00:27:53.840 --> 00:27:55.720\n- Do you have a process that you use\n\n670\n00:27:55.720 --> 00:28:00.720\nor to keep a look out on the up and coming stars?\n\n671\n00:28:01.160 --> 00:28:06.160\n- We do coffee roundtables in the organization.\n\n672\n00:28:06.160 --> 00:28:11.040\nWhen we do our talent process twice a year,\n\n673\n00:28:11.040 --> 00:28:13.800\nwe look at the entire leadership team\n\n674\n00:28:13.800 --> 00:28:15.520\nthroughout all the organizations\n\n675\n00:28:15.520 --> 00:28:17.280\nto kind of know who's on the radar.\n\n676\n00:28:17.280 --> 00:28:20.120\nI spend time with our interns during the summer.\n\n677\n00:28:20.120 --> 00:28:22.200\nI spend time with our executive trainees\n\n678\n00:28:22.200 --> 00:28:23.920\nwhen they join the company.\n\n679\n00:28:23.920 --> 00:28:25.960\nI try to meet every new person\n\n680\n00:28:25.960 --> 00:28:29.120\nthat comes into the company as a part of their onboarding.\n\n681\n00:28:29.120 --> 00:28:31.520\nAnd then stay abreast of in my touch bases\n\n682\n00:28:31.520 --> 00:28:33.720\nwith my direct reports, who's on your radar\n\n683\n00:28:33.720 --> 00:28:34.560\nthat I should know about?\n\n684\n00:28:34.560 --> 00:28:37.480\nWhat's going on in the organization\n\n685\n00:28:37.480 --> 00:28:40.080\nthat's kind of spiking up from a talent standpoint\n\n686\n00:28:40.080 --> 00:28:43.120\nthat we want to make sure that, you know, we're utilizing?\n\n687\n00:28:43.120 --> 00:28:45.200\n- I've talked to a number of leaders\n\n688\n00:28:45.200 --> 00:28:47.680\nwho have a list that they keep in their drawer\n\n689\n00:28:47.680 --> 00:28:49.520\nof like, you know, five to 10 people\n\n690\n00:28:49.520 --> 00:28:51.920\nthat they think they can't miss.\n\n691\n00:28:51.920 --> 00:28:54.920\nAnd they really try to give them extra attention.\n\n692\n00:28:54.920 --> 00:28:56.440\nDo you do anything like that\n\n693\n00:28:56.440 --> 00:28:59.280\nor do you just try to just mine the field\n\n694\n00:28:59.280 --> 00:29:03.240\nand, you know, get other people involved?\n\n695\n00:29:03.240 --> 00:29:05.120\n- I probably know the five to 10,\n\n696\n00:29:05.120 --> 00:29:07.120\nbut I feel like it's not enough in a company\n\n697\n00:29:07.120 --> 00:29:08.480\nof our size and scale.\n\n698\n00:29:08.480 --> 00:29:11.440\nSo I really try to mine the field as much as I can.\n\n699\n00:29:11.440 --> 00:29:13.200\nLike, we'll be going to a market.\n\n700\n00:29:13.200 --> 00:29:15.040\nI'll go to the Southern California market.\n\n701\n00:29:15.040 --> 00:29:18.200\nAnd during the travel time in cars between stores,\n\n702\n00:29:18.200 --> 00:29:22.200\nI'll be, you know, asking lots of who's top of the list,\n\n703\n00:29:22.200 --> 00:29:24.920\nwho's doing best, what are you most excited about?\n\n704\n00:29:24.920 --> 00:29:26.560\nWho needs additional support?\n\n705\n00:29:26.560 --> 00:29:28.280\nWhat kind of feedback have we given them?\n\n706\n00:29:28.280 --> 00:29:31.360\nSo I try to use the transportation time\n\n707\n00:29:31.360 --> 00:29:33.840\nto learn as much as I can when I'm out in the field.\n\n708\n00:29:33.840 --> 00:29:35.640\nAnd then, you know, in the central offices,\n\n709\n00:29:35.640 --> 00:29:38.680\nit's walking the hallways, it's asking questions,\n\n710\n00:29:38.680 --> 00:29:40.120\nit's inviting people.\n\n711\n00:29:40.120 --> 00:29:42.480\nI ask bring someone to your touch base,\n\n712\n00:29:42.480 --> 00:29:43.560\nbring one or two people.\n\n713\n00:29:43.560 --> 00:29:45.640\nI'd love to spend more time with your team.\n\n714\n00:29:45.640 --> 00:29:47.800\nSo it isn't just a presentation.\n\n715\n00:29:47.800 --> 00:29:48.920\nIt isn't just a conversation.\n\n716\n00:29:48.920 --> 00:29:52.160\nIt's also an opportunity to learn more about the function.\n\n717\n00:29:52.160 --> 00:29:55.120\nYou know, leaders cast a shadow and, you know,\n\n718\n00:29:55.120 --> 00:29:57.840\nthe rest of the team usually follows.\n\n719\n00:29:57.840 --> 00:30:01.040\nWhat's something that you do on purpose\n\n720\n00:30:01.040 --> 00:30:03.800\nbecause you know the whole company is watching\n\n721\n00:30:03.800 --> 00:30:06.920\nand taking note of what you're doing?\n\n722\n00:30:06.920 --> 00:30:10.240\n- I try to, so I don't wanna say that I do\n\n723\n00:30:10.240 --> 00:30:11.400\n'cause I think it's conceited,\n\n724\n00:30:11.400 --> 00:30:13.760\nbut I try to ask open-ended questions.\n\n725\n00:30:13.760 --> 00:30:17.040\nI try to make fewer declarative statements\n\n726\n00:30:17.040 --> 00:30:19.400\nbecause I'm a big believer in, you know,\n\n727\n00:30:19.400 --> 00:30:23.000\ncuriosity and intellectual curiosity\n\n728\n00:30:23.000 --> 00:30:27.000\nand querying, that there's so much to be learned\n\n729\n00:30:27.000 --> 00:30:29.480\nbeyond school that happens at work,\n\n730\n00:30:29.480 --> 00:30:30.800\nthat happens in technology,\n\n731\n00:30:30.800 --> 00:30:32.800\nthat happens in cultural moments,\n\n732\n00:30:32.800 --> 00:30:34.240\nthat if we're curious about what,\n\n733\n00:30:34.240 --> 00:30:36.000\nwho was wearing at the Oscars?\n\n734\n00:30:36.000 --> 00:30:38.200\nAnd we wanna know, you know what,\n\n735\n00:30:38.200 --> 00:30:41.360\nwho's telling the movie box office last weekend\n\n736\n00:30:41.360 --> 00:30:43.520\nwas incredible and wow, is Hollywood back?\n\n737\n00:30:43.520 --> 00:30:44.720\nAnd why did that happen?\n\n738\n00:30:44.720 --> 00:30:48.160\nAnd there's so much to be learned if you ask questions.\n\n739\n00:30:48.160 --> 00:30:50.600\nAnd I think it's, again, another lever\n\n740\n00:30:50.600 --> 00:30:52.400\nthat's available to everyone.\n\n741\n00:30:52.400 --> 00:30:54.120\n- Is that the number one behavior\n\n742\n00:30:54.120 --> 00:30:56.280\nthat you're trying to drive deep in your culture?\n\n743\n00:30:56.280 --> 00:30:58.520\n- I think collaboration would be the other one.\n\n744\n00:30:58.520 --> 00:31:01.480\nYes, curiosity and open-mindedness.\n\n745\n00:31:01.480 --> 00:31:03.440\nSo beyond leading your function,\n\n746\n00:31:03.440 --> 00:31:06.400\nyou also have to be kind of a feeder for your function,\n\n747\n00:31:06.400 --> 00:31:08.680\nasking other people for a perspective.\n\n748\n00:31:08.680 --> 00:31:12.360\nI love the book from Pixar Imagine\n\n749\n00:31:12.360 --> 00:31:15.120\nwhere, you know, you're gonna make the movie\n\n750\n00:31:15.120 --> 00:31:17.680\nas the writer and the director and the producer,\n\n751\n00:31:17.680 --> 00:31:20.120\nbut that doesn't absolve you of the responsibility\n\n752\n00:31:20.120 --> 00:31:21.880\nto get feedback from other people.\n\n753\n00:31:21.880 --> 00:31:26.240\nSo I think how you take information is really important.\n\n754\n00:31:26.240 --> 00:31:28.720\nThe team will hear me say time, time again.\n\n755\n00:31:28.720 --> 00:31:33.560\nI am very open to the skeptic.\n\n756\n00:31:33.560 --> 00:31:35.880\nI am not to the cynic.\n\n757\n00:31:35.880 --> 00:31:37.520\nSo there's a difference to me\n\n758\n00:31:37.520 --> 00:31:41.040\nbetween someone who has some great sage advice,\n\n759\n00:31:41.040 --> 00:31:45.080\nsome clear-minded opinion that is different than mine,\n\n760\n00:31:45.080 --> 00:31:47.240\nand then there's someone who's trying to sandbag\n\n761\n00:31:47.240 --> 00:31:49.680\nor hurt something, and that I'm less interested\n\n762\n00:31:49.680 --> 00:31:52.280\nand less tolerance for.\n\n763\n00:31:52.280 --> 00:31:54.680\n- That's interesting because I was gonna make\n\n764\n00:31:54.680 --> 00:31:57.400\none of the things culturally would be important to you,\n\n765\n00:31:57.400 --> 00:32:00.680\nand I'm sure it is, is the positive energy\n\n766\n00:32:00.680 --> 00:32:02.080\nbecause you have a lot of it.\n\n767\n00:32:02.080 --> 00:32:05.080\nAnd I was gonna ask you, how do you handle a cynic?\n\n768\n00:32:05.080 --> 00:32:08.440\nWhen you see a cynic, you know,\n\n769\n00:32:08.440 --> 00:32:10.320\nhow long do you put up with it?\n\n770\n00:32:10.320 --> 00:32:14.560\n- I hope less and less time.\n\n771\n00:32:14.560 --> 00:32:17.160\nYou know, again, I think you don't wanna close\n\n772\n00:32:17.160 --> 00:32:19.120\nthe door, close the door to the person\n\n773\n00:32:19.120 --> 00:32:21.720\nthat is giving you a devil's advocate\n\n774\n00:32:21.720 --> 00:32:26.720\nand playing the role of giving you the alternative point of view.\n\n775\n00:32:26.720 --> 00:32:29.440\nThat to me is so different than someone\n\n776\n00:32:29.440 --> 00:32:32.160\nwho is just constantly bringing the group down\n\n777\n00:32:32.160 --> 00:32:34.840\nand is trying to figure out how not to do something.\n\n778\n00:32:34.840 --> 00:32:37.760\nSo I have to take responsibility as the leader\n\n779\n00:32:37.760 --> 00:32:39.520\nand to make sure that we're sussing it out\n\n780\n00:32:39.520 --> 00:32:41.360\nand we're challenging people to,\n\n781\n00:32:41.360 --> 00:32:44.320\nit's not naively positive.\n\n782\n00:32:44.320 --> 00:32:48.600\nIt's not a polyanish that we are trying to deliver a business\n\n783\n00:32:48.600 --> 00:32:50.440\nbased on gracious hospitality.\n\n784\n00:32:50.440 --> 00:32:52.040\nWe're trying to deliver a business\n\n785\n00:32:52.040 --> 00:32:55.360\nwhere the customer is enjoying what they're doing with us.\n\n786\n00:32:55.360 --> 00:32:57.200\nWe have to then lead from the heart\n\n787\n00:32:57.200 --> 00:33:00.520\nwith that intentionality across the organization.\n\n788\n00:33:00.520 --> 00:33:03.360\n- You know, I wanna take you back to out Tony\n\n789\n00:33:03.360 --> 00:33:05.680\nfor a second, if you will.\n\n790\n00:33:05.680 --> 00:33:08.120\nYou know, growing up, what's the story\n\n791\n00:33:08.120 --> 00:33:11.600\nthat shaped the kind of leader that you are today?\n\n792\n00:33:11.600 --> 00:33:14.360\n- You know, I think, you know, having parents\n\n793\n00:33:14.360 --> 00:33:17.160\nthat cared about me, my father was a lawyer,\n\n794\n00:33:17.160 --> 00:33:19.920\nmy mother was a homemaker.\n\n795\n00:33:19.920 --> 00:33:23.840\nShe went back to work eventually as a real estate broker.\n\n796\n00:33:23.840 --> 00:33:26.320\nBut you know, they supported both my brother and I\n\n797\n00:33:26.320 --> 00:33:27.960\nand whatever we wanted to do,\n\n798\n00:33:27.960 --> 00:33:31.080\nupper middle class upbringing.\n\n799\n00:33:31.080 --> 00:33:36.000\nSo I felt very supported and when I found my passion,\n\n800\n00:33:36.000 --> 00:33:37.280\nI found my passion.\n\n801\n00:33:37.280 --> 00:33:39.160\nI think my father did say to me,\n\n802\n00:33:39.160 --> 00:33:40.280\nyou'd need to go to college\n\n803\n00:33:40.280 --> 00:33:42.200\n'cause I think at one point I was gonna stay working\n\n804\n00:33:42.200 --> 00:33:43.800\nat that Burger King.\n\n805\n00:33:43.800 --> 00:33:46.360\nAnd he said, I think you should try college first,\n\n806\n00:33:46.360 --> 00:33:48.200\nyou can always go back to Burger King.\n\n807\n00:33:48.200 --> 00:33:53.640\n- Do you ever have a moment where you still feel like a kid?\n\n808\n00:33:53.640 --> 00:33:54.720\n- I mean, it's amazing.\n\n809\n00:33:54.720 --> 00:33:57.040\nWhen you're a kid at heart, I mean,\n\n810\n00:33:57.040 --> 00:33:59.880\nI still go into a candy store and get excited.\n\n811\n00:33:59.880 --> 00:34:01.960\nAnd then I think, what am I doing with all this candy?\n\n812\n00:34:01.960 --> 00:34:03.400\nI don't know how to get this stuff.\n\n813\n00:34:03.400 --> 00:34:06.960\nBut it, I mean, the thing I love about children\n\n814\n00:34:06.960 --> 00:34:11.960\nis the insatiable, open-mindedness, imagination\n\n815\n00:34:11.960 --> 00:34:15.520\nthat I'm a big believer as you can hear in creativity\n\n816\n00:34:15.520 --> 00:34:19.040\nand the importance of trying to bring something different\n\n817\n00:34:19.040 --> 00:34:21.280\nthan just price to the equation.\n\n818\n00:34:21.280 --> 00:34:24.320\nAnd children have this wonderful moment\n\n819\n00:34:24.320 --> 00:34:26.520\nwhere they are not jaded by anything yet.\n\n820\n00:34:26.520 --> 00:34:29.000\nThey have not learned that they shouldn't say something\n\n821\n00:34:29.000 --> 00:34:31.480\nthat someone's gonna correct them for.\n\n822\n00:34:31.480 --> 00:34:33.440\n- Well, one of the things I did as a kid,\n\n823\n00:34:33.440 --> 00:34:36.000\nand I still do it every year,\n\n824\n00:34:36.000 --> 00:34:40.400\nis I just love the Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade,\n\n825\n00:34:40.400 --> 00:34:43.400\nwhich I think you've turned 100 years over the year.\n\n826\n00:34:43.400 --> 00:34:46.000\n- We do, this is the 100th parade, not the 100th year,\n\n827\n00:34:46.000 --> 00:34:48.440\n'cause we took a few years off for World War II.\n\n828\n00:34:48.440 --> 00:34:49.800\n- Okay, all right.\n\n829\n00:34:49.800 --> 00:34:52.920\nWell, tell me a behind the scenes story about the parade\n\n830\n00:34:52.920 --> 00:34:55.920\nthat most people probably have never heard.\n\n831\n00:34:55.920 --> 00:35:00.400\n- It's an incredible, magical moment for the country,\n\n832\n00:35:00.400 --> 00:35:02.760\nwhere over 30 million people tune in\n\n833\n00:35:02.760 --> 00:35:06.000\nand several million people come live in New York City\n\n834\n00:35:06.000 --> 00:35:10.120\nto see something that people spent almost a year producing.\n\n835\n00:35:10.120 --> 00:35:14.200\nAnd when I say producing, building the floats,\n\n836\n00:35:14.200 --> 00:35:19.200\nbuilding the balloons, making costumes,\n\n837\n00:35:19.200 --> 00:35:21.840\ncreating a television program\n\n838\n00:35:21.840 --> 00:35:25.360\nand deciding what acts are gonna go during what hour,\n\n839\n00:35:25.360 --> 00:35:30.360\n2,000 cans of paint, 4,500 different costumes,\n\n840\n00:35:31.360 --> 00:35:35.160\n70 foot balloons, wide and tall.\n\n841\n00:35:35.160 --> 00:35:39.320\nThe amount of work is unconscionable.\n\n842\n00:35:39.320 --> 00:35:43.080\nThe number of permits that we need to get in New York City,\n\n843\n00:35:43.080 --> 00:35:47.840\nthe amount of hours before 5 a.m. on the morning of Thanksgiving\n\n844\n00:35:47.840 --> 00:35:50.480\nthat team has to work to kind of orchestrate\n\n845\n00:35:50.480 --> 00:35:53.680\nfrom the Lincoln Tunnel all the way to the parade route\n\n846\n00:35:53.680 --> 00:35:58.680\nis a magical moment and it's a labor of love\n\n847\n00:35:59.000 --> 00:36:01.400\nand it's one that I have so much respect\n\n848\n00:36:01.400 --> 00:36:04.600\nafter spending time with our welders and our craftsmen\n\n849\n00:36:04.600 --> 00:36:07.880\nand our artists in our parade studio in New Jersey,\n\n850\n00:36:07.880 --> 00:36:10.720\nthey are incredibly talented.\n\n851\n00:36:10.720 --> 00:36:13.960\n- What's a day like for you as a CEO of the Macy's Day Parade?\n\n852\n00:36:13.960 --> 00:36:14.800\nWhat's that like?\n\n853\n00:36:14.800 --> 00:36:16.280\nWhat do you do?\n\n854\n00:36:16.280 --> 00:36:19.480\n- We do a little press, we do a little kind of breakfast\n\n855\n00:36:19.480 --> 00:36:21.280\nwith our team, kind of a, you know,\n\n856\n00:36:21.280 --> 00:36:24.160\nbefore the locker room, kind of game day talk,\n\n857\n00:36:24.160 --> 00:36:28.400\nthen we go down and visit with our friends at the Today Show.\n\n858\n00:36:28.400 --> 00:36:31.480\nAnd then I sit with my wife and some friends\n\n859\n00:36:31.480 --> 00:36:35.480\nand we watch the parade and we cheer as loud as possible.\n\n860\n00:36:35.480 --> 00:36:36.560\n- Yeah, awesome.\n\n861\n00:36:36.560 --> 00:36:41.560\nAnd, you know, this summer I read where you,\n\n862\n00:36:41.560 --> 00:36:45.640\nthe big red shopping bag sign came down at Macy's\n\n863\n00:36:45.640 --> 00:36:48.320\nthat you're, you know, you're a big New York store.\n\n864\n00:36:48.320 --> 00:36:49.400\nWhat was the reaction?\n\n865\n00:36:49.400 --> 00:36:51.600\n'Cause I'm curious, 'cause here you are,\n\n866\n00:36:51.600 --> 00:36:54.520\nyou're trying to modernize the brand,\n\n867\n00:36:54.520 --> 00:36:56.880\nyou know, create loyal customers.\n\n868\n00:36:56.880 --> 00:37:00.960\nWhat was the reaction to that and how did you make that decision?\n\n869\n00:37:00.960 --> 00:37:03.000\n- Well, it isn't our decision, you know,\n\n870\n00:37:03.000 --> 00:37:04.360\nwe don't own that building.\n\n871\n00:37:04.360 --> 00:37:09.360\nSo there are two small buildings as a part of the full square block\n\n872\n00:37:09.360 --> 00:37:13.240\nof Harold Square that we don't own, that's one of them.\n\n873\n00:37:13.240 --> 00:37:16.920\nAnd so the people that own the building have had a sign there\n\n874\n00:37:16.920 --> 00:37:18.640\nthat we've advertised on for years.\n\n875\n00:37:18.640 --> 00:37:20.960\nThey decided they wanted to take the sign down\n\n876\n00:37:20.960 --> 00:37:23.040\nand put up an electronic billboard.\n\n877\n00:37:23.040 --> 00:37:25.960\nAnd so, you know, it's like the passing of time.\n\n878\n00:37:25.960 --> 00:37:28.680\nI'm one of the few people that still reads a newspaper\n\n879\n00:37:28.680 --> 00:37:31.800\neven though I do read the times in the journal digitally,\n\n880\n00:37:31.800 --> 00:37:33.320\nbut things change.\n\n881\n00:37:33.320 --> 00:37:35.280\nAnd so, like an electronic sign\n\n882\n00:37:35.280 --> 00:37:39.520\nreplacing a a poster board sign, change happens.\n\n883\n00:37:39.520 --> 00:37:40.960\nIt's a nostalgic moment.\n\n884\n00:37:40.960 --> 00:37:42.320\nWe'll get a little piece of the sign\n\n885\n00:37:42.320 --> 00:37:45.760\nand put it in our archives to go with many of the other things\n\n886\n00:37:45.760 --> 00:37:50.560\nthat are a part of the 160 some odd story years of Macy's.\n\n887\n00:37:50.560 --> 00:37:53.400\n- You know, and you mentioned earlier\n\n888\n00:37:53.400 --> 00:37:58.200\nthat you have this, your own podcast, tell me about it\n\n889\n00:37:58.200 --> 00:38:01.520\nand tell me about somebody you've interviewed\n\n890\n00:38:01.520 --> 00:38:04.200\nthat you really learned a lot from as you did it.\n\n891\n00:38:04.200 --> 00:38:07.520\n- I interview people inside the company.\n\n892\n00:38:07.520 --> 00:38:10.600\nI interview people outside the company.\n\n893\n00:38:10.600 --> 00:38:14.640\nWhat I try to do, again, is share the story behind the story,\n\n894\n00:38:14.640 --> 00:38:17.680\na little bit like what you're doing today on leadership.\n\n895\n00:38:17.680 --> 00:38:21.880\nSo it's everything from the making of the Thanksgiving Day Parade,\n\n896\n00:38:21.880 --> 00:38:24.240\na one-on-one conversation between me\n\n897\n00:38:24.240 --> 00:38:27.880\nand the CEO of Ralph Lauren or me and the CEO of Levi's\n\n898\n00:38:27.880 --> 00:38:30.320\nor me and one of our board members\n\n899\n00:38:30.320 --> 00:38:33.480\nor me going to our supply chain center\n\n900\n00:38:33.480 --> 00:38:35.680\nor me visiting a store\n\n901\n00:38:35.680 --> 00:38:37.880\nor me talking to our merchant team\n\n902\n00:38:37.880 --> 00:38:39.800\nabout how we put together a assortment\n\n903\n00:38:39.800 --> 00:38:42.880\nand what it's like to decide\n\n904\n00:38:42.880 --> 00:38:45.640\non our cashmere strategy for this year.\n\n905\n00:38:45.640 --> 00:38:49.200\nSo it's a diverse mix of subjects\n\n906\n00:38:49.200 --> 00:38:52.160\ndesigned around the feedback we've had from our colleagues\n\n907\n00:38:52.160 --> 00:38:54.440\nabout what they want to learn more about.\n\n908\n00:38:54.440 --> 00:38:57.000\n- Was there one particular interview\n\n909\n00:38:57.000 --> 00:38:59.360\nthat really had a huge impact on you?\n\n910\n00:38:59.360 --> 00:39:01.400\n- Well, there are two.\n\n911\n00:39:01.400 --> 00:39:05.200\nThe first one I did, my son interviewed me.\n\n912\n00:39:05.200 --> 00:39:09.200\nSo that was hard\n\n913\n00:39:09.200 --> 00:39:12.080\nbecause I didn't control the questions.\n\n914\n00:39:12.080 --> 00:39:15.960\nAnd I think the audience did find it back to our conversation\n\n915\n00:39:15.960 --> 00:39:18.720\nabout how do people know I'm really a human being?\n\n916\n00:39:18.720 --> 00:39:21.400\nHow did they know that I put one sock on at a time?\n\n917\n00:39:21.400 --> 00:39:23.360\nMy son made sure they knew.\n\n918\n00:39:23.360 --> 00:39:26.320\nAnd the second thing I do is I have a leadership coach\n\n919\n00:39:26.320 --> 00:39:28.520\nwho I spend time with every week.\n\n920\n00:39:28.520 --> 00:39:31.600\nAnd I had my leadership coach interview me\n\n921\n00:39:31.600 --> 00:39:34.800\nand it was so good we made it into two episodes\n\n922\n00:39:34.800 --> 00:39:38.440\nbecause he got me to peel back the onion even further.\n\n923\n00:39:38.440 --> 00:39:39.800\n- Oh, that's great.\n\n924\n00:39:39.800 --> 00:39:43.400\nAnd what's the biggest thing you've uncovered working with him?\n\n925\n00:39:43.400 --> 00:39:46.600\n- He's a big believer in responsibility\n\n926\n00:39:46.600 --> 00:39:50.360\nand the idea that we have the ability to respond,\n\n927\n00:39:50.360 --> 00:39:53.520\nnot responsibility that we all have a lot on our plate.\n\n928\n00:39:53.520 --> 00:39:56.520\nAnd this idea that we have agency\n\n929\n00:39:56.520 --> 00:40:00.760\nand that so much is how we choose to bring ourselves\n\n930\n00:40:00.760 --> 00:40:05.040\nto a conversation, how we are aware of the moods\n\n931\n00:40:05.040 --> 00:40:07.680\nand the attitudes of people that come into a meeting,\n\n932\n00:40:07.680 --> 00:40:11.280\nsomebody just lost their dog, somebody is running late\n\n933\n00:40:11.280 --> 00:40:12.800\nbecause their child is sick at home.\n\n934\n00:40:12.800 --> 00:40:16.280\nIt's like everybody brings something into the room.\n\n935\n00:40:16.280 --> 00:40:19.280\nIf you step back for a second and are aware,\n\n936\n00:40:19.280 --> 00:40:22.080\nyou can help the room be more productive.\n\n937\n00:40:22.080 --> 00:40:24.720\nYou yourself can be more effective.\n\n938\n00:40:24.720 --> 00:40:27.520\nAnd I think he's done a great job with me\n\n939\n00:40:27.520 --> 00:40:29.320\non both self-awareness\n\n940\n00:40:29.320 --> 00:40:33.040\nand in helping the team practice the art of responsibility,\n\n941\n00:40:33.040 --> 00:40:34.840\nthe ability to respond.\n\n942\n00:40:34.840 --> 00:40:36.320\nYou should feel everything.\n\n943\n00:40:36.320 --> 00:40:37.960\nYou don't have to say everything.\n\n944\n00:40:37.960 --> 00:40:45.160\n- Say more on that, the feeling versus saying.\n\n945\n00:40:45.160 --> 00:40:46.760\nThat's interesting.\n\n946\n00:40:46.760 --> 00:40:49.640\n- Well, part of his model is suppression\n\n947\n00:40:49.640 --> 00:40:51.080\nis a very unhealthy thing.\n\n948\n00:40:51.080 --> 00:40:54.280\nAnd a lot of times we hold back and you know,\n\n949\n00:40:54.280 --> 00:40:55.800\nmy dad could get upset.\n\n950\n00:40:55.800 --> 00:40:59.360\nHe would wait till something really, really bothered him\n\n951\n00:40:59.360 --> 00:41:01.120\nand then he would be very hostile.\n\n952\n00:41:01.120 --> 00:41:03.320\nAnd I think what my coaches taught me is\n\n953\n00:41:03.320 --> 00:41:05.600\nmake sure you feel when you feel.\n\n954\n00:41:05.600 --> 00:41:08.440\nAnd then you decide based on audience appropriate\n\n955\n00:41:08.440 --> 00:41:09.720\nwhat you wanna say.\n\n956\n00:41:09.720 --> 00:41:10.800\nBut don't miss the opportunity,\n\n957\n00:41:10.800 --> 00:41:13.320\n'cause if you don't feel it, you're pushing it down\n\n958\n00:41:13.320 --> 00:41:15.240\nand ultimately it's gonna come back out\n\n959\n00:41:15.240 --> 00:41:16.720\nin some way, shape, or form that\n\n960\n00:41:16.720 --> 00:41:19.160\nis not necessarily you at your best.\n\n961\n00:41:19.160 --> 00:41:22.440\n- Fifting back to the business and your strategy,\n\n962\n00:41:22.440 --> 00:41:25.880\nyou mentioned AI a little bit earlier.\n\n963\n00:41:25.880 --> 00:41:29.040\nYou know, how are you leading from that front?\n\n964\n00:41:29.040 --> 00:41:31.800\n- So I'm a big believer in the importance\n\n965\n00:41:31.800 --> 00:41:34.520\nof humanity and technology.\n\n966\n00:41:34.520 --> 00:41:37.800\nSo I'm gonna tell you it's end, not an or.\n\n967\n00:41:37.800 --> 00:41:40.720\nAnd so we have a AI program\n\n968\n00:41:40.720 --> 00:41:42.520\nthat supports the bold new chapter.\n\n969\n00:41:42.520 --> 00:41:44.360\nWe don't have an AI strategy.\n\n970\n00:41:44.360 --> 00:41:46.240\nWe have a bold new chapter strategy\n\n971\n00:41:46.240 --> 00:41:50.640\nthat is powered by our belief in the importance of AI.\n\n972\n00:41:50.640 --> 00:41:52.760\nWe divide it into three segments.\n\n973\n00:41:52.760 --> 00:41:56.880\nWe have probably over now 100 different proof of concepts.\n\n974\n00:41:56.880 --> 00:41:58.600\nSome that have to be retired.\n\n975\n00:41:58.600 --> 00:42:00.360\nSome that have to be scaled.\n\n976\n00:42:00.360 --> 00:42:02.960\nBut they're basically a third, a third, a third, David.\n\n977\n00:42:02.960 --> 00:42:04.960\nA third that are revenue generating.\n\n978\n00:42:04.960 --> 00:42:07.080\nA third that are designed to make it easier\n\n979\n00:42:07.080 --> 00:42:09.520\nfor our customers or easier for our colleagues.\n\n980\n00:42:09.520 --> 00:42:12.360\nAnd then a third that are focused on efficiency\n\n981\n00:42:12.360 --> 00:42:15.840\nand how quickly we can do things with less money.\n\n982\n00:42:15.840 --> 00:42:19.640\n- How are you using AI to help you do your job better?\n\n983\n00:42:19.640 --> 00:42:25.000\n- You know, I'm putting speeches into AI.\n\n984\n00:42:25.000 --> 00:42:28.560\nI am using an AI coach that we also rolled out\n\n985\n00:42:28.560 --> 00:42:32.040\nto our leaders as a pilot this year.\n\n986\n00:42:32.040 --> 00:42:34.680\nJust to see the difference in terms of, you know,\n\n987\n00:42:34.680 --> 00:42:36.280\nthings that you want to have a conversation\n\n988\n00:42:36.280 --> 00:42:37.880\nwith a direct report.\n\n989\n00:42:37.880 --> 00:42:40.800\nThe AI coach can kind of take on the persona\n\n990\n00:42:40.800 --> 00:42:43.880\nand help you kind of refine the language you might want to use.\n\n991\n00:42:43.880 --> 00:42:45.200\nAnd well, lo and behold,\n\n992\n00:42:45.200 --> 00:42:47.000\nthe conversation's far more effective.\n\n993\n00:42:47.000 --> 00:42:49.400\nSo that's certainly one way.\n\n994\n00:42:49.400 --> 00:42:53.840\nI'm using it to try to refine my messaging to my team.\n\n995\n00:42:53.840 --> 00:42:59.800\nJust going through working on some feedback forms.\n\n996\n00:42:59.800 --> 00:43:02.840\nAnd I start because I don't like to turn over\n\n997\n00:43:02.840 --> 00:43:06.400\nthe entire thing to AI, but I then give prompts\n\n998\n00:43:06.400 --> 00:43:09.000\nand get to a place where I think the content\n\n999\n00:43:09.000 --> 00:43:10.520\nis frankly better.\n\n1000\n00:43:10.520 --> 00:43:14.240\n- A lot of people that I talk to that are maximizing AI,\n\n1001\n00:43:14.240 --> 00:43:16.840\nthey really believe that in their culture,\n\n1002\n00:43:16.840 --> 00:43:18.720\nthey're going to have to teach people\n\n1003\n00:43:18.720 --> 00:43:20.160\nhow to ask better questions.\n\n1004\n00:43:20.160 --> 00:43:23.960\nWhat's your thinking on that?\n\n1005\n00:43:23.960 --> 00:43:25.400\n- I agree 100%.\n\n1006\n00:43:25.400 --> 00:43:26.240\nYou know what?\n\n1007\n00:43:26.240 --> 00:43:29.640\nAnd by the way, shouldn't we have been doing that all long?\n\n1008\n00:43:29.640 --> 00:43:33.840\nSo, you know, great questions lead to really interesting answers.\n\n1009\n00:43:33.840 --> 00:43:37.120\nAnd as a reporter, as someone who does a podcast,\n\n1010\n00:43:37.120 --> 00:43:38.600\nif you don't ask the question,\n\n1011\n00:43:38.600 --> 00:43:40.480\nit's really hard then to get an answer.\n\n1012\n00:43:40.480 --> 00:43:42.960\nSo I think prompts are just another way for us\n\n1013\n00:43:42.960 --> 00:43:46.200\nto return to being better communicators.\n\n1014\n00:43:46.200 --> 00:43:50.160\nAnd, you know, I know we each experienced something different\n\n1015\n00:43:50.160 --> 00:43:51.320\nduring the pandemic.\n\n1016\n00:43:51.320 --> 00:43:54.040\nThe thing that was the hardest, I think,\n\n1017\n00:43:54.040 --> 00:43:56.680\non not only our business, but our people\n\n1018\n00:43:56.680 --> 00:43:58.720\nwas the loss of human connection.\n\n1019\n00:43:58.720 --> 00:44:02.320\nAnd I think we are still trying to navigate the,\n\n1020\n00:44:02.320 --> 00:44:06.240\nI want to have a life and I want to embrace the flexibility\n\n1021\n00:44:06.240 --> 00:44:10.720\nthat technology and shopping at home and virtual reality.\n\n1022\n00:44:10.720 --> 00:44:13.040\nAnd there's so many things that we can do,\n\n1023\n00:44:13.040 --> 00:44:16.480\nbut nothing replaces being with someone you love,\n\n1024\n00:44:16.480 --> 00:44:19.520\ngoing someplace you love, eating something you love.\n\n1025\n00:44:19.520 --> 00:44:22.000\nAnd so how does then the use of tools\n\n1026\n00:44:22.000 --> 00:44:23.560\nhelp me to do more of that?\n\n1027\n00:44:23.560 --> 00:44:26.960\nHow does it help me to change my time allocation?\n\n1028\n00:44:26.960 --> 00:44:28.320\n- You're right on it.\n\n1029\n00:44:28.320 --> 00:44:29.920\nThis has been so much fun.\n\n1030\n00:44:29.920 --> 00:44:32.680\nYou know, I've learned a lot just in this conversation.\n\n1031\n00:44:32.680 --> 00:44:34.000\nAnd I want to add a little bit more fun\n\n1032\n00:44:34.000 --> 00:44:35.600\nwith my lightning round of questions here.\n\n1033\n00:44:35.600 --> 00:44:36.960\nSo are you ready for this?\n\n1034\n00:44:36.960 --> 00:44:38.080\n- I am ready.\n\n1035\n00:44:38.080 --> 00:44:41.840\n- The three words your team would use to describe you.\n\n1036\n00:44:41.840 --> 00:44:46.840\n- Passionate, curious, and open.\n\n1037\n00:44:46.840 --> 00:44:49.320\n- If you could be one person for a day\n\n1038\n00:44:49.320 --> 00:44:51.160\nbeside yourself, who would it be?\n\n1039\n00:44:51.160 --> 00:44:52.440\n- Abraham Lincoln.\n\n1040\n00:44:52.440 --> 00:44:54.200\n- Your biggest pet peeve.\n\n1041\n00:44:54.200 --> 00:44:56.280\n- People that talk over other people.\n\n1042\n00:44:56.280 --> 00:44:58.120\n- Who would play you in a movie?\n\n1043\n00:44:58.120 --> 00:45:01.800\n- I've had people joke and tell me it could be Rob Lowe\n\n1044\n00:45:01.800 --> 00:45:04.240\non the positive side, it could be Rick Moranis\n\n1045\n00:45:04.240 --> 00:45:06.240\non people who are being sarcastic.\n\n1046\n00:45:06.240 --> 00:45:08.080\n- Well, that's a habit you have\n\n1047\n00:45:08.080 --> 00:45:11.280\nthat's been instrumental to the success that you've had.\n\n1048\n00:45:11.280 --> 00:45:14.760\n- I'm pretty good at time management.\n\n1049\n00:45:14.760 --> 00:45:16.480\n- The best Broadway show you've seen\n\n1050\n00:45:16.480 --> 00:45:18.280\nin the past couple of years.\n\n1051\n00:45:18.280 --> 00:45:20.240\n- Well, I'm on the board of Lincoln Center Theater,\n\n1052\n00:45:20.240 --> 00:45:23.600\nso I have to plug a ragtime, which just won some Tonys.\n\n1053\n00:45:23.600 --> 00:45:26.080\nAnd that was quite amazing.\n\n1054\n00:45:26.080 --> 00:45:27.800\n- Your favorite restaurant in New York City\n\n1055\n00:45:27.800 --> 00:45:29.240\nwhen we go there.\n\n1056\n00:45:29.240 --> 00:45:31.560\n- That is really tough too.\n\n1057\n00:45:31.560 --> 00:45:33.760\nMy favorite restaurant in New York City\n\n1058\n00:45:33.760 --> 00:45:37.920\nis Houtang, a Chinese restaurant up town.\n\n1059\n00:45:37.920 --> 00:45:39.840\n- What's something you've been curious about lately\n\n1060\n00:45:39.840 --> 00:45:42.640\nthat has absolutely nothing to do with work?\n\n1061\n00:45:42.640 --> 00:45:45.040\n- I'm constantly curious about politics.\n\n1062\n00:45:45.040 --> 00:45:48.160\nSo I can talk less about politics at work.\n\n1063\n00:45:48.160 --> 00:45:50.200\nI can barely talk about it at home,\n\n1064\n00:45:50.200 --> 00:45:53.840\nbut I am very curious about where the world is going.\n\n1065\n00:45:53.840 --> 00:45:56.120\n- The one thing that you do just for you?\n\n1066\n00:45:56.120 --> 00:46:01.520\n- Play games, read, you know, I like escape time.\n\n1067\n00:46:01.520 --> 00:46:05.360\nSo I will find that isolation moment,\n\n1068\n00:46:05.360 --> 00:46:06.480\nit doesn't have to be long,\n\n1069\n00:46:06.480 --> 00:46:08.880\nbut I like to do something by myself.\n\n1070\n00:46:08.880 --> 00:46:10.640\n- Besides your family and friends,\n\n1071\n00:46:10.640 --> 00:46:12.600\nwhat's your most prized possession?\n\n1072\n00:46:12.600 --> 00:46:16.640\n- I was honored by the American Jewish Committee\n\n1073\n00:46:16.640 --> 00:46:21.200\nand I have a original copy of a Winston Churchill book.\n\n1074\n00:46:21.200 --> 00:46:24.880\n- If I turned on the radio in your car, what would I hear?\n\n1075\n00:46:24.880 --> 00:46:26.600\n- Well, you probably used to hear Howard Stern\n\n1076\n00:46:26.600 --> 00:46:28.720\nwhen I was driving, I'm not driving anymore.\n\n1077\n00:46:28.720 --> 00:46:31.440\nSo now it could be the News, I don't know,\n\n1078\n00:46:31.440 --> 00:46:33.840\nthe News 880 in New York,\n\n1079\n00:46:33.840 --> 00:46:36.920\nor I could be listening to CNN or Fox News.\n\n1080\n00:46:36.920 --> 00:46:38.040\nThat's another one of my habits\n\n1081\n00:46:38.040 --> 00:46:40.000\nis I do like to listen to everybody,\n\n1082\n00:46:40.000 --> 00:46:43.480\nso I'm not jaded by one definition.\n\n1083\n00:46:43.480 --> 00:46:46.240\n- What's something about you that few people would know?\n\n1084\n00:46:46.240 --> 00:46:48.160\n- I eat ice cream every night.\n\n1085\n00:46:48.160 --> 00:46:50.920\nBut I've told the team that it is a vice\n\n1086\n00:46:50.920 --> 00:46:53.480\nthat I am having trouble giving up.\n\n1087\n00:46:53.480 --> 00:46:55.160\nCertainly as my cholesterol went up\n\n1088\n00:46:55.160 --> 00:46:57.360\nand as my weight has came,\n\n1089\n00:46:57.360 --> 00:47:01.480\nbut I feel like God, one life, ice cream is so good.\n\n1090\n00:47:01.480 --> 00:47:03.920\nHow can I not have it every day?\n\n1091\n00:47:03.920 --> 00:47:06.120\n- Well, I think you just answered my last question\n\n1092\n00:47:06.120 --> 00:47:07.280\nthe lightning round was,\n\n1093\n00:47:07.280 --> 00:47:09.040\nwhat's one of your daily rituals\n\n1094\n00:47:09.040 --> 00:47:10.560\nsomething that you'd never miss?\n\n1095\n00:47:10.560 --> 00:47:11.480\nIce cream!\n\n1096\n00:47:11.480 --> 00:47:13.680\n(laughing)\n\n1097\n00:47:13.680 --> 00:47:16.640\nAlden's ice cream, I have to plug Alden's.\n\n1098\n00:47:16.640 --> 00:47:17.480\n- That's great.\n\n1099\n00:47:17.480 --> 00:47:18.760\nOkay, we're out of the lightning round,\n\n1100\n00:47:18.760 --> 00:47:21.640\njust a few more questions here and I'll let you go.\n\n1101\n00:47:21.640 --> 00:47:24.600\nYou know, how do you think about leadership at home, Tony?\n\n1102\n00:47:25.680 --> 00:47:30.240\n- Look, I am very fortunate to have an incredible wife\n\n1103\n00:47:30.240 --> 00:47:34.760\nwho is not only a great mother, a great wife,\n\n1104\n00:47:34.760 --> 00:47:36.440\nbut great sounding board.\n\n1105\n00:47:36.440 --> 00:47:41.440\nSo she will be a source of inspiration for me.\n\n1106\n00:47:41.440 --> 00:47:44.080\nShe'll be a source of calm for me.\n\n1107\n00:47:44.080 --> 00:47:49.000\nAnd she's done an amazing job helping raise our two boys.\n\n1108\n00:47:49.000 --> 00:47:51.720\nI'm very proud of both of them.\n\n1109\n00:47:51.720 --> 00:47:55.600\nAnd she reminded me that I could do anything,\n\n1110\n00:47:55.600 --> 00:47:57.200\nbut I can't do everything.\n\n1111\n00:47:57.200 --> 00:48:00.800\nSo I was at almost every concert\n\n1112\n00:48:00.800 --> 00:48:02.840\nat every parent teacher night,\n\n1113\n00:48:02.840 --> 00:48:05.880\nat many of their ball games.\n\n1114\n00:48:05.880 --> 00:48:08.880\nI sometimes came with mail, I'll admit it,\n\n1115\n00:48:08.880 --> 00:48:11.640\nbut I was paying attention most of the time.\n\n1116\n00:48:11.640 --> 00:48:13.920\nBut no, I will seriously say to my team,\n\n1117\n00:48:13.920 --> 00:48:16.320\nyou can't do everything and you have to be honest.\n\n1118\n00:48:16.320 --> 00:48:18.960\nIf you're really all in, you can't do everything,\n\n1119\n00:48:18.960 --> 00:48:20.200\nbut you can do anything.\n\n1120\n00:48:20.200 --> 00:48:22.480\nAnd if parent teacher night is important,\n\n1121\n00:48:22.480 --> 00:48:24.760\nif being there when you're first day of school,\n\n1122\n00:48:24.760 --> 00:48:27.000\nif you've got an issue at home,\n\n1123\n00:48:27.000 --> 00:48:29.360\nwe need to show greater flexibility\n\n1124\n00:48:29.360 --> 00:48:31.200\nto let people be successful in life\n\n1125\n00:48:31.200 --> 00:48:33.160\nin the fullest sense of the word.\n\n1126\n00:48:33.160 --> 00:48:34.600\nBut you also have to be honest,\n\n1127\n00:48:34.600 --> 00:48:36.600\nas the leader, as the individual,\n\n1128\n00:48:36.600 --> 00:48:38.520\nyou can't be in two places at one time.\n\n1129\n00:48:38.520 --> 00:48:41.280\n- What has your family taught you about leadership\n\n1130\n00:48:41.280 --> 00:48:42.360\nthat Macy's never could?\n\n1131\n00:48:42.360 --> 00:48:43.560\nWas it that?\n\n1132\n00:48:43.560 --> 00:48:45.800\n- Oh, you don't control everything.\n\n1133\n00:48:45.800 --> 00:48:48.280\nI mean, I think again, when I started out,\n\n1134\n00:48:48.280 --> 00:48:50.480\nI was like gonna work and gonna do.\n\n1135\n00:48:50.480 --> 00:48:53.720\nAnd as I rose in responsibility and leadership,\n\n1136\n00:48:53.720 --> 00:48:57.520\nand I had, I was directing more people and more strategy\n\n1137\n00:48:57.520 --> 00:48:59.320\nand people would listen to what I say.\n\n1138\n00:48:59.320 --> 00:49:02.680\nI was like, no, you just, you maybe have a louder voice.\n\n1139\n00:49:02.680 --> 00:49:05.440\nYou have a different series of initials next to your name.\n\n1140\n00:49:05.440 --> 00:49:08.640\nBut everybody comes to the table with a personality,\n\n1141\n00:49:08.640 --> 00:49:11.240\nwith a point of view, with ideas.\n\n1142\n00:49:11.240 --> 00:49:15.080\nAnd my kids did not always listen to my advice.\n\n1143\n00:49:15.080 --> 00:49:17.760\nSometimes they completely ignored what I had to say.\n\n1144\n00:49:17.760 --> 00:49:21.240\nSo it was a good lesson for what leadership was like at work.\n\n1145\n00:49:21.240 --> 00:49:23.440\n- What do you see, Tony, as your unfinished business,\n\n1146\n00:49:23.440 --> 00:49:26.800\nnot only at Macy's, but for yourself personally?\n\n1147\n00:49:26.800 --> 00:49:30.000\n- I obviously wanna make sure that Macy's best days\n\n1148\n00:49:30.000 --> 00:49:31.280\nare still ahead of us.\n\n1149\n00:49:31.280 --> 00:49:34.120\nMacy's ink, Macy's Bloomingdale's Blue Mercury\n\n1150\n00:49:34.120 --> 00:49:36.640\nis an incredible retail franchise.\n\n1151\n00:49:36.640 --> 00:49:39.040\nIf I didn't own the stock, I'd buy the stock.\n\n1152\n00:49:39.040 --> 00:49:40.480\nIf I didn't work for the company,\n\n1153\n00:49:40.480 --> 00:49:42.080\nI'd wanna work for the company.\n\n1154\n00:49:42.080 --> 00:49:45.200\nIt's a place where you can go from being a colleague\n\n1155\n00:49:45.200 --> 00:49:48.200\non the sales floor to running the company one day.\n\n1156\n00:49:48.200 --> 00:49:49.440\nThat's the opportunity.\n\n1157\n00:49:49.440 --> 00:49:52.600\nI wanna make sure that this business is around\n\n1158\n00:49:52.600 --> 00:49:55.960\nto support many, many, many more generations to come.\n\n1159\n00:49:55.960 --> 00:49:58.560\nIt thrills me to see the number of people\n\n1160\n00:49:58.560 --> 00:50:00.520\nthat come to us when a baby is born.\n\n1161\n00:50:00.520 --> 00:50:02.800\nThe number of people that come to us for a prom dress.\n\n1162\n00:50:02.800 --> 00:50:05.200\nThe number of people that come to us to buy a watch\n\n1163\n00:50:05.200 --> 00:50:08.960\nbecause they want an analog watch now for graduation.\n\n1164\n00:50:08.960 --> 00:50:10.520\nIt's a wonderful feeling,\n\n1165\n00:50:10.520 --> 00:50:13.360\nbut I want your relevancies a funny thing.\n\n1166\n00:50:13.360 --> 00:50:16.200\nYou have to be relevant in the timeframe you're in.\n\n1167\n00:50:16.200 --> 00:50:18.200\nSo if I was selling black and white TVs,\n\n1168\n00:50:18.200 --> 00:50:20.080\nI wouldn't be very relevant today.\n\n1169\n00:50:20.080 --> 00:50:23.080\nSo you really gotta keep re-examining your assortments,\n\n1170\n00:50:23.080 --> 00:50:25.680\nmaking sure you're doing everything that's necessary,\n\n1171\n00:50:25.680 --> 00:50:27.760\nthat people are what people are wearing,\n\n1172\n00:50:27.760 --> 00:50:29.320\nhow they're acting, how they're living,\n\n1173\n00:50:29.320 --> 00:50:30.640\nwhat their homes look like.\n\n1174\n00:50:30.640 --> 00:50:33.560\nThat's gonna ensure our greatest and our brightest future.\n\n1175\n00:50:33.560 --> 00:50:36.800\nAnd then personally, I wanna make sure that I'm giving back.\n\n1176\n00:50:36.800 --> 00:50:40.280\nSo whether it's the boards that I'm on with Lincoln Center\n\n1177\n00:50:40.280 --> 00:50:43.320\nor with the NRF, our Retail Federation Foundation\n\n1178\n00:50:43.320 --> 00:50:45.920\nor the Hospital of Special Surgery here in New York,\n\n1179\n00:50:45.920 --> 00:50:48.720\nor my son was diagnosed with juvenile diabetes\n\n1180\n00:50:48.720 --> 00:50:50.360\nwhen he was seven,\n\n1181\n00:50:50.360 --> 00:50:54.520\nand I was on the juvenile diabetes board for 25 years.\n\n1182\n00:50:54.520 --> 00:50:57.120\nI wanna make sure that I'm doing what I can\n\n1183\n00:50:57.120 --> 00:51:00.200\nwith the position that I have to give back\n\n1184\n00:51:00.200 --> 00:51:01.800\nto the next generation,\n\n1185\n00:51:01.800 --> 00:51:05.080\nto give back to people that are not as fortunate\n\n1186\n00:51:05.080 --> 00:51:06.960\nas I have been in my life.\n\n1187\n00:51:06.960 --> 00:51:09.160\n- That's great, and speaking of diabetes,\n\n1188\n00:51:09.160 --> 00:51:11.600\nmy late wife was the type one diabetic,\n\n1189\n00:51:11.600 --> 00:51:15.120\nand we have the Wendy Novak Diabetes Institute in Louisville,\n\n1190\n00:51:15.120 --> 00:51:17.880\nand we're trying to do everything we can to find a cure\n\n1191\n00:51:17.880 --> 00:51:20.960\nand help people deal with pregnancy\n\n1192\n00:51:20.960 --> 00:51:22.520\nand deal with sports.\n\n1193\n00:51:22.520 --> 00:51:26.720\nBut we've made a lot of progress, but there's more to be made.\n\n1194\n00:51:26.720 --> 00:51:28.160\nSo thank you for everything you're doing\n\n1195\n00:51:28.160 --> 00:51:29.560\non that front as well.\n\n1196\n00:51:29.560 --> 00:51:31.400\n- Now, thank you for doing your part too.\n\n1197\n00:51:31.400 --> 00:51:34.120\nAgain, it's one day, one step closer,\n\n1198\n00:51:34.120 --> 00:51:36.520\nand people sometimes don't realize\n\n1199\n00:51:36.520 --> 00:51:39.320\nthat you're living with diabetes.\n\n1200\n00:51:39.320 --> 00:51:42.360\nThere's no cure, and there is a daily regimen\n\n1201\n00:51:42.360 --> 00:51:44.920\nthat you're describing between what you eat, the exercise,\n\n1202\n00:51:44.920 --> 00:51:47.400\nand the insulin you take, that is,\n\n1203\n00:51:47.400 --> 00:51:51.000\nthank God there is a pump today and more science,\n\n1204\n00:51:51.000 --> 00:51:54.880\nbut it's not easy for those people, not just kids.\n\n1205\n00:51:54.880 --> 00:51:58.440\n- Absolutely, and I always say when it comes to diabetes,\n\n1206\n00:51:58.440 --> 00:52:00.160\nyou never get a day off,\n\n1207\n00:52:00.160 --> 00:52:02.420\nand you know what I'm talking about there.\n\n1208\n00:52:02.420 --> 00:52:05.120\nAll right, last question here.\n\n1209\n00:52:05.120 --> 00:52:08.360\nWhat's one piece of advice you'd give to anyone\n\n1210\n00:52:08.360 --> 00:52:10.240\nwho wants to be a better leader?\n\n1211\n00:52:10.240 --> 00:52:13.160\n- Two ears, one mouth.\n\n1212\n00:52:13.160 --> 00:52:16.280\nThe line I give to everybody is hit the ground listening.\n\n1213\n00:52:16.280 --> 00:52:18.960\nWhen you join our company, everybody's telling people\n\n1214\n00:52:18.960 --> 00:52:20.920\nto hit the ground running, I'm like, do not,\n\n1215\n00:52:20.920 --> 00:52:23.480\nI'll cut your legs off, hit the ground listening.\n\n1216\n00:52:23.480 --> 00:52:25.200\nHoneymoon's come once.\n\n1217\n00:52:25.200 --> 00:52:26.720\nYou wanna learn.\n\n1218\n00:52:26.720 --> 00:52:29.120\nThis is your time, no one's expecting anything.\n\n1219\n00:52:29.120 --> 00:52:30.960\nYou actually have the clearest view\n\n1220\n00:52:30.960 --> 00:52:32.440\nwhen you come into the company.\n\n1221\n00:52:32.440 --> 00:52:34.240\nAnd by the way, the clearest view means\n\n1222\n00:52:34.240 --> 00:52:36.720\nyou don't have the right answer 'cause you don't know enough\n\n1223\n00:52:36.720 --> 00:52:38.960\nand you see things that we've stopped seeing.\n\n1224\n00:52:38.960 --> 00:52:40.440\nKeep a little journal.\n\n1225\n00:52:40.440 --> 00:52:42.280\nSo hit the ground listening.\n\n1226\n00:52:42.280 --> 00:52:43.960\nI love it, I love it.\n\n1227\n00:52:43.960 --> 00:52:45.920\nWell, I have to tell you, Tony,\n\n1228\n00:52:45.920 --> 00:52:48.160\nI've been very inspired by this conversation.\n\n1229\n00:52:48.160 --> 00:52:50.920\nI really believe positive energy lifts you up\n\n1230\n00:52:50.920 --> 00:52:52.520\nand you've got a lot of it\n\n1231\n00:52:52.520 --> 00:52:54.640\nand I'm sure people love working with you.\n\n1232\n00:52:54.640 --> 00:52:57.080\nSo thanks for taking the time to be on the show.\n\n1233\n00:52:57.080 --> 00:52:57.960\n- Thank you for having me.\n\n1234\n00:52:57.960 --> 00:52:59.000\nIt was a lot of fun.\n\n1235\n00:52:59.000 --> 00:53:06.400\n- David, when that conversation ended,\n\n1236\n00:53:06.400 --> 00:53:08.280\nyou said, wow, he has a lot of positive energy\n\n1237\n00:53:08.280 --> 00:53:09.640\nand it's so true what you said.\n\n1238\n00:53:09.640 --> 00:53:12.480\nHis positive energy has really lifted me up.\n\n1239\n00:53:12.480 --> 00:53:15.480\nIt's so refreshing to have somebody\n\n1240\n00:53:15.480 --> 00:53:17.840\nwith such positive energy just come in\n\n1241\n00:53:17.840 --> 00:53:19.120\nand have a great conversation.\n\n1242\n00:53:19.120 --> 00:53:19.960\nThat was awesome.\n\n1243\n00:53:19.960 --> 00:53:21.120\n- Well, he loves his job.\n\n1244\n00:53:21.120 --> 00:53:22.160\nHe loves his people.\n\n1245\n00:53:22.160 --> 00:53:23.720\nHe loves the brands.\n\n1246\n00:53:23.720 --> 00:53:28.400\nAnd he wants to make a difference at Macy's\n\n1247\n00:53:28.400 --> 00:53:31.720\nand in the world, which is terrific.\n\n1248\n00:53:31.720 --> 00:53:34.240\n- I like we do every conversation, David.\n\n1249\n00:53:34.240 --> 00:53:37.840\nI'm excited to get your thoughts on some of the key things\n\n1250\n00:53:37.840 --> 00:53:40.560\nand topics that just really stood out to me\n\n1251\n00:53:40.560 --> 00:53:42.480\nthroughout this conversation with you and Tony.\n\n1252\n00:53:42.480 --> 00:53:44.600\nThe first one is that thought that he shared\n\n1253\n00:53:44.600 --> 00:53:46.200\nat the very end of the episode.\n\n1254\n00:53:46.200 --> 00:53:49.760\nHe tells his employees to hit the ground listening\n\n1255\n00:53:49.760 --> 00:53:52.160\nwhen they start their career at Macy's.\n\n1256\n00:53:52.160 --> 00:53:53.600\nAnd I just love that.\n\n1257\n00:53:53.600 --> 00:53:55.360\nI like that it's a play on that phrase.\n\n1258\n00:53:55.360 --> 00:53:56.880\nWe always hear hit the ground running,\n\n1259\n00:53:56.880 --> 00:53:59.600\nbut it really reinforces the importance\n\n1260\n00:53:59.600 --> 00:54:02.240\nof having two ears and one mouth.\n\n1261\n00:54:02.240 --> 00:54:04.280\nWhat did you like about that?\n\n1262\n00:54:04.280 --> 00:54:07.560\n- Oh, I loved it because you need to listen before you run.\n\n1263\n00:54:07.560 --> 00:54:11.000\nAnd I think every leader needs to recognize\n\n1264\n00:54:11.000 --> 00:54:12.760\nwhen you take on a new role,\n\n1265\n00:54:12.760 --> 00:54:16.280\nyou've got the opportunity to have fresh eyes.\n\n1266\n00:54:16.280 --> 00:54:19.280\nAnd the best way to get the best insights\n\n1267\n00:54:19.280 --> 00:54:21.280\nis to truly listen.\n\n1268\n00:54:21.280 --> 00:54:25.240\nAnd I've had people give me advice\n\n1269\n00:54:25.240 --> 00:54:27.600\nand I give others the same advice\n\n1270\n00:54:27.600 --> 00:54:31.160\nthat you really needed to develop a 90-day plan\n\n1271\n00:54:31.160 --> 00:54:33.040\nwhen you take on a new job,\n\n1272\n00:54:33.040 --> 00:54:36.160\nthat you use 90 days to really listen\n\n1273\n00:54:36.160 --> 00:54:38.560\nand understand what the heck's going on\n\n1274\n00:54:38.560 --> 00:54:40.400\nbefore you sit down at the piano\n\n1275\n00:54:40.400 --> 00:54:42.440\nand write out the song.\n\n1276\n00:54:42.440 --> 00:54:46.480\nAnd so I think he's right on there.\n\n1277\n00:54:46.480 --> 00:54:48.560\n- You talk about David doing that listening tour.\n\n1278\n00:54:48.560 --> 00:54:51.360\nWhat are some of your favorite go-to questions\n\n1279\n00:54:51.360 --> 00:54:53.880\nthat you tell people to ask during those first 90 days\n\n1280\n00:54:53.880 --> 00:54:55.240\nto really get the full picture\n\n1281\n00:54:55.240 --> 00:54:57.360\nof what's going on in the business?\n\n1282\n00:54:57.360 --> 00:55:01.040\n- I always ask, what are you hearing from customers?\n\n1283\n00:55:01.040 --> 00:55:06.080\nWhat do you think we should be doing that we're not doing?\n\n1284\n00:55:06.080 --> 00:55:09.320\nAnd one thing I always asked was,\n\n1285\n00:55:09.320 --> 00:55:11.120\nwhat do you think I need to do?\n\n1286\n00:55:11.120 --> 00:55:13.440\nI mean, how can I best support you?\n\n1287\n00:55:13.440 --> 00:55:18.440\nAnd I found that when you're in the positions of power,\n\n1288\n00:55:18.440 --> 00:55:22.920\nyou need to ask that question more than once, okay?\n\n1289\n00:55:22.920 --> 00:55:26.120\nSo when you ask somebody what they would do\n\n1290\n00:55:26.120 --> 00:55:28.760\nif they were you, they'll usually say nothing, okay?\n\n1291\n00:55:28.760 --> 00:55:30.920\nSo ask it again, they'll usually say nothing\n\n1292\n00:55:30.920 --> 00:55:32.680\nand then ask it another time\n\n1293\n00:55:32.680 --> 00:55:36.200\nand they'll probably begin to give you an idea or two\n\n1294\n00:55:36.200 --> 00:55:38.920\nthat maybe you really need to hear.\n\n1295\n00:55:38.920 --> 00:55:43.840\nSo I think you really, really must let people know\n\n1296\n00:55:43.840 --> 00:55:46.520\nthat you wanna hear from them, okay?\n\n1297\n00:55:46.520 --> 00:55:49.560\nAnd along those lines, I like the fact that\n\n1298\n00:55:49.560 --> 00:55:52.160\nhe differentiated between a skeptic or someone\n\n1299\n00:55:52.160 --> 00:55:56.400\nwho has a wise counsel based on experience versus a cynic\n\n1300\n00:55:56.400 --> 00:56:01.200\nwho's basically trying to derail whatever you have going along.\n\n1301\n00:56:01.200 --> 00:56:04.800\nAnd so I think he's really got a good handle\n\n1302\n00:56:04.800 --> 00:56:09.040\non the importance of listening\n\n1303\n00:56:09.040 --> 00:56:13.080\nand understanding and being curious.\n\n1304\n00:56:13.080 --> 00:56:14.480\n- Yeah, I agree.\n\n1305\n00:56:14.480 --> 00:56:16.000\nAnother thing that really stood out to me\n\n1306\n00:56:16.000 --> 00:56:18.680\nwas the part of the conversation where he talked about\n\n1307\n00:56:18.680 --> 00:56:22.120\nfeeling everything, not saying everything.\n\n1308\n00:56:22.120 --> 00:56:24.640\nAnd I love that because it kind of plays into\n\n1309\n00:56:24.640 --> 00:56:26.000\nwhat we talk about a lot on this show,\n\n1310\n00:56:26.000 --> 00:56:29.080\nwhich is the importance of self-awareness\n\n1311\n00:56:29.080 --> 00:56:32.040\nand how you respond in situations real time.\n\n1312\n00:56:32.040 --> 00:56:35.280\nWhat stood out to you about that discussion, David?\n\n1313\n00:56:35.280 --> 00:56:40.240\n- Well, I think it's an interesting way to think about\n\n1314\n00:56:40.240 --> 00:56:43.880\nhow you should interact with others is that\n\n1315\n00:56:43.880 --> 00:56:50.040\nyou need to share your feelings when you feel them.\n\n1316\n00:56:50.040 --> 00:56:51.680\nDon't bottle them up.\n\n1317\n00:56:51.680 --> 00:56:53.280\nDon't wait and wait and wait\n\n1318\n00:56:53.280 --> 00:56:55.880\nand then have this huge eruption.\n\n1319\n00:56:55.880 --> 00:57:00.520\nBut when you feel something, let your team know\n\n1320\n00:57:00.520 --> 00:57:03.080\nwhat you're feeling, okay?\n\n1321\n00:57:03.080 --> 00:57:07.680\nAnd so that you can address it together.\n\n1322\n00:57:07.680 --> 00:57:11.320\nAnd a lot of times people think about what they need to say\n\n1323\n00:57:11.320 --> 00:57:14.520\nbut they don't really think about how they're feeling\n\n1324\n00:57:14.520 --> 00:57:18.120\nand how they need to convey that message.\n\n1325\n00:57:18.120 --> 00:57:21.600\nAnd I think when you share your feelings,\n\n1326\n00:57:21.600 --> 00:57:23.800\nyou do what everybody is talking about\n\n1327\n00:57:23.800 --> 00:57:25.840\nas a major trait in successful leaders\n\n1328\n00:57:25.840 --> 00:57:29.040\nis that you open up, you're vulnerable.\n\n1329\n00:57:29.040 --> 00:57:30.520\nYou're an open book.\n\n1330\n00:57:30.520 --> 00:57:35.040\nAnd I think being an open book is really powerful\n\n1331\n00:57:35.040 --> 00:57:36.840\nand as a leader.\n\n1332\n00:57:36.840 --> 00:57:40.160\nYou just don't have to have all the answers all the time\n\n1333\n00:57:40.160 --> 00:57:43.800\nand talk all the time and say this and say that.\n\n1334\n00:57:43.800 --> 00:57:47.160\nYou can be honest and share the feelings that you have.\n\n1335\n00:57:47.160 --> 00:57:50.200\n- I like that he shared too, sometimes in situations,\n\n1336\n00:57:50.200 --> 00:57:53.000\nyou feel really charged about something\n\n1337\n00:57:53.000 --> 00:57:55.600\nand it kind of takes a second to cool off\n\n1338\n00:57:55.600 --> 00:57:58.440\nand really figure out how you want to communicate\n\n1339\n00:57:58.440 --> 00:58:00.080\nwhat you're feeling to your team.\n\n1340\n00:58:00.080 --> 00:58:03.760\nSo what I love about that is that it says to people\n\n1341\n00:58:03.760 --> 00:58:07.480\nthat it's okay to take a second and to calm down\n\n1342\n00:58:07.480 --> 00:58:10.280\nand to really understand how you can communicate\n\n1343\n00:58:10.280 --> 00:58:13.000\nwhat you're feeling in a way that'll be most effective\n\n1344\n00:58:13.000 --> 00:58:14.800\nfor whatever you're trying to do.\n\n1345\n00:58:14.800 --> 00:58:17.640\nAnd I'm curious, David, if there's a time in your career\n\n1346\n00:58:17.640 --> 00:58:19.680\nwhere your face is a lot of pressure\n\n1347\n00:58:19.680 --> 00:58:21.160\nand you might have not agreed with somebody\n\n1348\n00:58:21.160 --> 00:58:23.720\nand your first instinct was to just say everything\n\n1349\n00:58:23.720 --> 00:58:25.480\nthat was on your mind.\n\n1350\n00:58:25.480 --> 00:58:30.480\nHow do you manage that stress and scenarios like that?\n\n1351\n00:58:30.480 --> 00:58:33.160\n- I think that's one of the things I struggle with.\n\n1352\n00:58:33.160 --> 00:58:34.880\nI'm a high feeling person.\n\n1353\n00:58:34.880 --> 00:58:37.240\nSo if I'm feeling something,\n\n1354\n00:58:37.240 --> 00:58:40.960\nit's very hard for me to not share it, okay?\n\n1355\n00:58:40.960 --> 00:58:45.960\nAnd I think I needed to and have learned how\n\n1356\n00:58:45.960 --> 00:58:48.840\nto and need to continue to think about\n\n1357\n00:58:48.840 --> 00:58:51.880\nhow to temper my feelings.\n\n1358\n00:58:51.880 --> 00:58:56.880\nI was recently in a meeting where I felt like\n\n1359\n00:58:56.880 --> 00:58:59.440\nthe team wasn't being acknowledged enough\n\n1360\n00:58:59.440 --> 00:59:02.880\nfor the tremendous progress that they'd made.\n\n1361\n00:59:02.880 --> 00:59:07.880\nAnd that feeling came out through me saying\n\n1362\n00:59:07.880 --> 00:59:13.160\nhow I truly felt about it,\n\n1363\n00:59:13.160 --> 00:59:16.840\nwhich I think generated a lot of respect\n\n1364\n00:59:16.840 --> 00:59:18.840\nbecause of my honesty.\n\n1365\n00:59:18.840 --> 00:59:22.360\nAnd it opened up a few people's eyes.\n\n1366\n00:59:22.360 --> 00:59:25.240\nBut I have to tell you, when I look back at it,\n\n1367\n00:59:25.240 --> 00:59:26.440\nI think I could have done it better\n\n1368\n00:59:26.440 --> 00:59:29.640\nbecause I got a little bit too emotional, okay?\n\n1369\n00:59:29.640 --> 00:59:32.480\nYou know, used language that maybe I shouldn't have used.\n\n1370\n00:59:32.480 --> 00:59:34.320\n- It's easy to do.\n\n1371\n00:59:34.320 --> 00:59:35.720\n- But I made the point.\n\n1372\n00:59:35.720 --> 00:59:39.400\nAnd I think the fact that I did\n\n1373\n00:59:39.400 --> 00:59:41.720\nand the fact I've always done that\n\n1374\n00:59:41.720 --> 00:59:45.800\nhas been one of the things that's made me an effective leader\n\n1375\n00:59:45.800 --> 00:59:49.480\nbecause people know what they see is what they get.\n\n1376\n00:59:49.480 --> 00:59:50.480\n- Absolutely.\n\n1377\n00:59:50.480 --> 00:59:52.000\nIt's so refreshing.\n\n1378\n00:59:52.000 --> 00:59:53.400\n- At least part of the time, cool.\n\n1379\n00:59:53.400 --> 00:59:54.520\nAt least part of the time.\n\n1380\n00:59:54.520 --> 00:59:56.520\nI'm not saying it'll affect you all the time,\n\n1381\n00:59:56.520 --> 00:59:57.760\nbut I do try.\n\n1382\n00:59:57.760 --> 01:00:00.280\n- It is so refreshing to be in an environment\n\n1383\n01:00:00.280 --> 01:00:01.560\nwhere you never have to guess\n\n1384\n01:00:01.560 --> 01:00:02.560\nhow they had to press some fields\n\n1385\n01:00:02.560 --> 01:00:03.400\nor what they're thinking.\n\n1386\n01:00:03.400 --> 01:00:07.120\nSo David, another theme that stood out to me\n\n1387\n01:00:07.120 --> 01:00:10.880\nis Tony's obsession with hospitality.\n\n1388\n01:00:10.880 --> 01:00:13.480\nHe talked about being at Cornell in their hospitality school\n\n1389\n01:00:13.480 --> 01:00:15.360\nand how he tries to weave that\n\n1390\n01:00:15.360 --> 01:00:18.960\ninto the company that he's leading at Macy's.\n\n1391\n01:00:18.960 --> 01:00:20.720\nI'm curious as a leader,\n\n1392\n01:00:20.720 --> 01:00:22.520\nI mean, you were in the food industry,\n\n1393\n01:00:22.520 --> 01:00:25.640\nbut as leaders of really any industry,\n\n1394\n01:00:25.640 --> 01:00:27.960\nhow should we be thinking about hospitality\n\n1395\n01:00:27.960 --> 01:00:31.040\nand how to weave that into our interactions\n\n1396\n01:00:31.040 --> 01:00:32.120\nwith our customers?\n\n1397\n01:00:32.120 --> 01:00:37.120\n- I think take pride in whatever you're a part of.\n\n1398\n01:00:37.120 --> 01:00:40.560\nAnd I loved his analogy of,\n\n1399\n01:00:40.560 --> 01:00:43.880\nthink about what you're doing is your home, okay?\n\n1400\n01:00:43.880 --> 01:00:47.400\nYou know, do you welcome people when they come to your home?\n\n1401\n01:00:47.400 --> 01:00:50.160\nIs your house cleaned up when they come?\n\n1402\n01:00:50.160 --> 01:00:54.720\nDo you, is this something that you take care of or not?\n\n1403\n01:00:54.720 --> 01:00:57.880\nIs this something you constantly want to improve?\n\n1404\n01:00:57.880 --> 01:00:59.160\nKeep up the date.\n\n1405\n01:00:59.160 --> 01:01:04.160\nYou know, I think that that home visual or home story\n\n1406\n01:01:04.160 --> 01:01:07.960\nis one that works for any business.\n\n1407\n01:01:07.960 --> 01:01:11.040\nSo take pride, take pride of home ownership\n\n1408\n01:01:11.040 --> 01:01:12.720\nin whatever business you're in.\n\n1409\n01:01:12.720 --> 01:01:16.680\n- I love the example that he shared around.\n\n1410\n01:01:16.680 --> 01:01:18.560\nThe feedback he got from customers saying\n\n1411\n01:01:18.560 --> 01:01:20.480\nthat the dressing rooms just were messy\n\n1412\n01:01:20.480 --> 01:01:21.760\nand they didn't like going in there.\n\n1413\n01:01:21.760 --> 01:01:26.120\nAnd he talked about, like if the dressing rooms\n\n1414\n01:01:26.120 --> 01:01:27.400\nwhere they're looking at the items\n\n1415\n01:01:27.400 --> 01:01:29.520\nthat they want to purchase aren't in good condition,\n\n1416\n01:01:29.520 --> 01:01:31.000\nthen they're not going to be willing to purchase\n\n1417\n01:01:31.000 --> 01:01:32.160\nthe thing that they're trying on.\n\n1418\n01:01:32.160 --> 01:01:34.080\nAnd he talked about how he led his team\n\n1419\n01:01:34.080 --> 01:01:35.600\nthrough enhancing that experience.\n\n1420\n01:01:35.600 --> 01:01:38.480\nAnd he mentioned that, you know, conversation\n\n1421\n01:01:38.480 --> 01:01:39.880\nleads to conversion.\n\n1422\n01:01:39.880 --> 01:01:43.560\nSo I just love that little thought around, you know,\n\n1423\n01:01:43.560 --> 01:01:45.440\nif you're interacting with a customer,\n\n1424\n01:01:45.440 --> 01:01:47.120\nit's really easy to not start a conversation,\n\n1425\n01:01:47.120 --> 01:01:49.360\nbut it's also really easy to start a conversation.\n\n1426\n01:01:49.360 --> 01:01:52.240\nAnd usually that leads to a great experience overall\n\n1427\n01:01:52.240 --> 01:01:54.760\nand hopefully for your business, a conversion.\n\n1428\n01:01:54.760 --> 01:01:56.280\nAnd I just love that little tidbit.\n\n1429\n01:01:56.280 --> 01:01:57.880\nI mean, I'll think about, you know,\n\n1430\n01:01:57.880 --> 01:02:01.000\nour customers being listeners up the podcast,\n\n1431\n01:02:01.000 --> 01:02:02.920\nwe don't interact with them face to face,\n\n1432\n01:02:02.920 --> 01:02:05.520\nbut it's an interesting thing to think about.\n\n1433\n01:02:05.520 --> 01:02:07.520\nYou know, how could we start conversation with them\n\n1434\n01:02:07.520 --> 01:02:12.040\nso that they become more engaged with the content\n\n1435\n01:02:12.040 --> 01:02:12.880\nthat we're pushing out?\n\n1436\n01:02:12.880 --> 01:02:15.400\nI just love that little phrase.\n\n1437\n01:02:15.400 --> 01:02:18.360\n- Well, Dale Carnegie, who's, you know,\n\n1438\n01:02:18.360 --> 01:02:21.120\nit's the greatest salesman that ever lived,\n\n1439\n01:02:21.120 --> 01:02:24.760\nyou know, said the best way to really, you know,\n\n1440\n01:02:24.760 --> 01:02:28.720\nmake a sale is to get people to talk about themselves.\n\n1441\n01:02:28.720 --> 01:02:33.360\nAnd so if you're actually showing interest in other people,\n\n1442\n01:02:33.360 --> 01:02:35.600\nthey'll take an interest in you.\n\n1443\n01:02:35.600 --> 01:02:38.960\nAnd, you know, I think that's what he means about, you know,\n\n1444\n01:02:38.960 --> 01:02:41.360\nhaving that, having that relationship.\n\n1445\n01:02:41.360 --> 01:02:44.560\nAnd that's why he thinks hospitality is so important.\n\n1446\n01:02:44.560 --> 01:02:46.960\nIt's that, you know, when you get out the credit card\n\n1447\n01:02:46.960 --> 01:02:49.880\nhe talked about, somebody hand you the credit book,\n\n1448\n01:02:49.880 --> 01:02:50.800\ncan't you see their name?\n\n1449\n01:02:50.800 --> 01:02:52.360\nSo you say, hey, thank you, Kool.\n\n1450\n01:02:52.360 --> 01:02:55.400\nI really appreciate you spending that $2,000 on that dress.\n\n1451\n01:02:55.400 --> 01:02:56.520\nSo that's really nice to be here.\n\n1452\n01:02:56.520 --> 01:03:00.880\nCan I buy, can I get you a, can I show you another one?\n\n1453\n01:03:00.880 --> 01:03:05.440\n- Unfortunately, the answer to that question is usually like,\n\n1454\n01:03:05.440 --> 01:03:06.920\nyes, when I'm asked it.\n\n1455\n01:03:06.920 --> 01:03:10.040\nSo somebody's doing a good job of being hospitable\n\n1456\n01:03:10.040 --> 01:03:11.720\nat the checkout.\n\n1457\n01:03:11.720 --> 01:03:13.800\n- Great. Well, I think in the end here,\n\n1458\n01:03:13.800 --> 01:03:15.880\nthere were a lot of great insights in this podcast,\n\n1459\n01:03:15.880 --> 01:03:19.120\nbut, you know, hit the ground listening is terrific.\n\n1460\n01:03:19.120 --> 01:03:22.720\nFeel everything, you know, share your feelings, you know,\n\n1461\n01:03:22.720 --> 01:03:25.560\ndon't just talk, but share your feelings of why.\n\n1462\n01:03:25.560 --> 01:03:28.800\nAnd then, you know, think about hospitality,\n\n1463\n01:03:28.800 --> 01:03:30.640\ntake pride in the home ownership\n\n1464\n01:03:30.640 --> 01:03:32.080\nand whatever business that you have.\n\n1465\n01:03:32.080 --> 01:03:34.800\nI think those are our three really good takeaways\n\n1466\n01:03:34.800 --> 01:03:39.800\nthat anyone can walk away with and use from this conversation.\n\n1467\n01:03:39.800 --> 01:03:41.760\n- I love it.\n\n1468\n01:03:41.760 --> 01:03:43.720\nWell, David, thank you so much for another episode\n\n1469\n01:03:43.720 --> 01:03:44.560\nof How Leaders Lead.\n\n1470\n01:03:44.560 --> 01:03:46.560\nThank you, Tony Spring for joining us\n\n1471\n01:03:46.560 --> 01:03:48.760\nand sharing your insights with our listeners.\n\n1472\n01:03:48.760 --> 01:03:51.400\nAnd thank you to our listeners for tuning in\n\n1473\n01:03:51.400 --> 01:03:52.680\nto How Leaders Lead.\n\n1474\n01:03:52.680 --> 01:03:53.960\nWe will see you next week.\n","is_pinned",false,"pinned_at","is_featured","featured_at","mix_url","https://chtbl.com/track/DCB44F/traffic.megaphone.fm/DVL7384811486.mp3","dx_media_id",4258,"video_media_id","thumbnail_image_media_id","published_date","2026-08-27","itunes_episode_id",306,"youtube_id","lnzEgt7KVqU","2026-08-27T15:12:50.000000Z","Listen to this leadership podcast with Tony Spring, Chairman and CEO of Macy’s, and discover how to listen your way to better strategy, culture, and results.","dx_url","https://dnl.nyc3.cdn.digitaloceanspaces.com/uploads/KVrD6BsLtIe0vIxKX8PwtSz5UQJVOrX7QmsEcRDf.mp3","dx_filename","KVrD6BsLtIe0vIxKX8PwtSz5UQJVOrX7QmsEcRDf.mp3","dx_mux_playback_id","35y02C027Tcl6002iPcixRz42obZ4n2WiUuLJWbalBvmLQ","dx_waveform_url","https://dnl.nyc3.cdn.digitaloceanspaces.com/uploads/waveforms/4258.json","video_url","video_mux_playback_id","duration",3834714,"thumbnail_url","https://img.youtube.com/vi/lnzEgt7KVqU/maxresdefault.jpg","thumbnail_image_url","dx_media",{"_13":66,"_96":80,"_97":78,"_98":99,"_31":82,"_33":100,"_101":-5,"_102":84,"_87":88,"_103":-5},"video_media","thumbnail_image_media","filename","url","status","ready","Efm3U1Q4sUtVKgvbi6ennB5AYXNx4OoQKwGcCyeIk2c","mux_upload_id","waveform_url","preview_media_id","first_name","Tony","last_name","Spring","job_title","Macy's, Inc., Chairman and CEO","Tony Spring, Macy’s, CEO, retail","external_links","https://www.linkedin.com/in/tony-spring,https://shareourstrength.org/podcast/a-ceo-for-whom-social-purpose-is-always-in-fashion-tony-spring-on-leadership-hospitality-and-no-kid-hungry/",0,"image_media_id",4221,4222,"2026-08-30T19:11:30.000000Z","send_push_notification_at","2026-08-31T19:00:00.000000Z","image_url","https://dnl.nyc3.cdn.digitaloceanspaces.com/uploads/lZgZrpEHGTIu5wYBfNbkLpTdCAmRe24NwdwlwZMD.jpg","https://dnl.nyc3.cdn.digitaloceanspaces.com/uploads/u6ZwUPXFH0UHBdOhV9XVXLVAp0uSRJFvfLF3vsBM.jpg","https://www.howleaderslead.com/leaders/295/tony-spring","industry_id",4,"industry",{"_13":125,"_136":137,"_138":140},"industries",[135],"image_media",{"_13":115,"_96":134,"_97":121,"_98":-5,"_31":-5,"_33":-5,"_101":-5,"_102":-5,"_87":-5,"_103":-5},{"_13":116,"_96":133,"_97":122,"_98":-5,"_31":-5,"_33":-5,"_101":-5,"_102":-5,"_87":-5,"_103":-5},"u6ZwUPXFH0UHBdOhV9XVXLVAp0uSRJFvfLF3vsBM.jpg","lZgZrpEHGTIu5wYBfNbkLpTdCAmRe24NwdwlwZMD.jpg",{"_13":125,"_136":137,"_138":139},"name","Retail and E-commerce","pivot",{"_35":36,"_124":125},{"_35":36,"_124":125},"user","token","favorites",[],"collections",[],"env",{"_149":150,"_151":152,"_153":154,"_155":156,"_157":158},"GOOGLE_CLIENT_ID","644017954836-qpllhu38r0tsrtfq85ukntcvsb0akbht.apps.googleusercontent.com","APPLE_CLIENT_ID","com.howleaderslead.webapp","APPLE_REDIRECT_URI","https://www.howleaderslead.com/auth/apple-callback","APP_URL","https://howleaderslead.com","GTM_ID",""]