[{"_1":2,"_3":-5,"_4":-5},"loaderData",{"_5":6,"_7":8},"actionData","errors","root",{"_145":-5,"_146":-5,"_147":148,"_149":150,"_151":152},"routes/clips.$id.$slug",{"_9":10,"_11":12},"clip",{"_13":14,"_15":16,"_17":-5,"_18":19,"_20":-5,"_21":22,"_23":24,"_25":26,"_27":28,"_29":30,"_31":32,"_33":34,"_35":36,"_37":38,"_39":40,"_41":-5,"_42":-5,"_43":-5,"_44":45,"_46":-5,"_47":48,"_49":50,"_51":-5},"canonicalUrl","https://howleaderslead.com/clips/3477/you-can-learn-so-much-about-someone-on-the-golf-course","id",3477,"title","You can learn so much about someone on the golf course","subtitle","transcript","WEBVTT\n\n1\n00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.960\nI often ask a room, like, how many people here play golf?\n\n2\n00:00:02.960 --> 00:00:05.160\nAnd in many of the rooms, it's, you know,\n\n3\n00:00:05.160 --> 00:00:07.000\na very small percentage.\n\n4\n00:00:07.000 --> 00:00:11.080\nAnd I asked them to think about the three people\n\n5\n00:00:11.080 --> 00:00:14.080\nin the world that they would most like to learn from.\n\n6\n00:00:14.080 --> 00:00:17.000\nThen they get the idea of that, and I say, well, you know,\n\n7\n00:00:17.000 --> 00:00:18.600\nif you were to get a meeting with them,\n\n8\n00:00:18.600 --> 00:00:22.400\nit would likely be a Zoom and it'd be 30 minutes.\n\n9\n00:00:22.400 --> 00:00:26.480\nAnd, but if you were so lucky to play golf\n\n10\n00:00:26.480 --> 00:00:31.480\nwith that same person, you could be together six hours.\n\n11\n00:00:31.480 --> 00:00:35.720\nYou know, if you throw in a meal and a drink afterwards,\n\n12\n00:00:35.720 --> 00:00:37.480\nthat's 12 beatings.\n\n13\n00:00:37.480 --> 00:00:39.960\nYou're not gonna get 12 meetings with anyone in five years.\n\n14\n00:00:39.960 --> 00:00:43.080\nAnd so the knowledge transfer that can happen\n\n15\n00:00:43.080 --> 00:00:46.520\nin a game of golf, the wisdom that can be imparted,\n\n16\n00:00:46.520 --> 00:00:49.480\nbut also the understanding of the human,\n\n17\n00:00:49.480 --> 00:00:52.640\ndoes he or she cheat, right?\n\n18\n00:00:52.640 --> 00:00:55.600\nAre they angry, you know, during the whole round\n\n19\n00:00:55.600 --> 00:00:58.480\nwhen they make a mistake, you learn so much\n\n20\n00:00:58.480 --> 00:01:01.600\nabout the humanity of the person in a game of golf.\n\n21\n00:01:01.600 --> 00:01:04.520\nIt's one of my favorite things to do with people\n\n22\n00:01:04.520 --> 00:01:07.440\nthat I wanna do something, you know, big with.\n","pretty_transcript","start_time",2179179,"end_time",2246599,"keywords","Golf, relationships, character, wisdom, networking","slug","you-can-learn-so-much-about-someone-on-the-golf-course","origin","cms","mux_playback_id","BX6DPrFW9pFgEnOmeYedGqkjXK801u97Yjk4AZrgckkA","mux_asset_id","lCPgrKCEfCBsC00W4nyAIVgH02A00pmmVwDQIZz9nFJIS8","leader_id",299,"episode_id",448,"updated_at","2026-09-24T19:55:17.000000Z","meta_title","meta_description","og_image_media_id","web_url","https://www.howleaderslead.com/clips/3477/you-can-learn-so-much-about-someone-on-the-golf-course","og_image_url","leader",{"_13":36,"_104":105,"_106":107,"_108":109,"_25":110,"_111":112,"_61":113,"_58":113,"_114":115,"_68":116,"_39":117,"_118":119,"_41":-5,"_42":-5,"_43":-5,"_120":121,"_91":122,"_44":123,"_124":125,"_126":127,"_46":-5,"_128":129,"_130":131,"_95":132,"_51":-5},"episode",{"_13":38,"_15":52,"_27":53,"_17":54,"_55":56,"_18":57,"_20":-5,"_58":59,"_60":-5,"_61":59,"_62":-5,"_63":64,"_65":66,"_67":-5,"_68":-5,"_69":70,"_71":72,"_73":74,"_35":36,"_39":75,"_41":-5,"_42":76,"_43":-5,"_77":78,"_79":80,"_81":82,"_83":84,"_85":-5,"_86":-5,"_87":88,"_89":90,"_91":-5,"_46":-5,"_92":93,"_94":-5,"_95":-5,"_51":-5},"og_image_media","Recognize how others shape you","recognize-how-others-shape-you","An inspiring conversation to help you find the people who bring out the best in you – and become that for others, too.","summary","

A lot of leaders brag that they’re “self made.”

Demond Martin says he’s “community built.”

He recognizes all the people who helped him move out of a violent environment as a preteen and go on to work at the White House, graduate from Harvard Business School, and become a successful hedge fund manager.

Now, as the Cofounder and CEO of the wellness brand WellWithAll, he’s trying to do the same for others – putting a portion of profits toward ending health inequity.

In this conversation, you’ll get an inspiring look at Demond’s philosophy of being a “friend of the good” – someone who sees the humanity in other people and builds relationships on respect, not transactions.

When you learn how to surround yourself with those people (while striving to be one yourself!), you’ll find a whole new level of meaning and purpose in leadership.

This episode is for you if:

You’re wondering if you can scale a business while keeping people at the center
You want to either find a mentor – or become one
You want to develop more ways to give back through your business
You could use a big jolt of inspiration

","WEBVTT\n\n1\n00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.840\n- Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode\n\n2\n00:00:02.840 --> 00:00:05.280\nof How Leaders Lead with David Novak.\n\n3\n00:00:05.280 --> 00:00:07.160\nToday's guest is DeMond Martin.\n\n4\n00:00:07.160 --> 00:00:09.800\nHe's the co-founder and CEO of Well With All,\n\n5\n00:00:09.800 --> 00:00:12.000\na consumer wellness company whose purpose\n\n6\n00:00:12.000 --> 00:00:14.360\nis to advance health equity.\n\n7\n00:00:14.360 --> 00:00:17.040\nIn fact, they give away 20% of their profits\n\n8\n00:00:17.040 --> 00:00:19.760\nto that very cause, making healthier products,\n\n9\n00:00:19.760 --> 00:00:22.840\nuseful health information, and support more accessible\n\n10\n00:00:22.840 --> 00:00:25.200\nto communities that have been underserved.\n\n11\n00:00:25.200 --> 00:00:27.840\nDeMond also has a new book out called Friends of the Good,\n\n12\n00:00:27.840 --> 00:00:30.240\nwhich is all about building lasting relationships\n\n13\n00:00:30.240 --> 00:00:32.800\nthat go beyond convenience and show up\n\n14\n00:00:32.800 --> 00:00:35.200\nin both joy and in hardship.\n\n15\n00:00:35.200 --> 00:00:37.760\nA central idea in his book and in his leadership\n\n16\n00:00:37.760 --> 00:00:41.680\nis that we are community built, not self-made.\n\n17\n00:00:41.680 --> 00:00:43.440\nAnd in this episode, you'll learn\n\n18\n00:00:43.440 --> 00:00:46.000\nwhy that concept is so important.\n\n19\n00:00:46.000 --> 00:00:48.480\nEnjoy this conversation with DeMond and David,\n\n20\n00:00:48.480 --> 00:00:51.920\nand I will see you at the end of the episode for the debrief.\n\n21\n00:00:57.480 --> 00:00:58.880\nI don't know if you know this,\n\n22\n00:00:58.880 --> 00:01:02.160\nbut we have a mutual friend in Larry Fitzgerald.\n\n23\n00:01:02.160 --> 00:01:06.120\nAnd how cool is it to see that great wide receiver\n\n24\n00:01:06.120 --> 00:01:08.280\ngoing to the NFL Hall of Fame this summer?\n\n25\n00:01:08.280 --> 00:01:10.080\n- Oh man, that was so amazing.\n\n26\n00:01:10.080 --> 00:01:12.640\nI literally just talked to Larry last night.\n\n27\n00:01:12.640 --> 00:01:14.840\nHe is a great human.\n\n28\n00:01:14.840 --> 00:01:18.280\nI mean, he's been an amazing football player,\n\n29\n00:01:18.280 --> 00:01:20.400\nbut who he is as a human, Trump's dad,\n\n30\n00:01:20.400 --> 00:01:22.600\nin such an extraordinary way.\n\n31\n00:01:22.600 --> 00:01:24.520\n- Yeah, I could not agree more.\n\n32\n00:01:24.520 --> 00:01:27.080\nBut when you think about a Hall of Famer,\n\n33\n00:01:27.080 --> 00:01:29.080\nwhat do you think would be the qualities\n\n34\n00:01:29.080 --> 00:01:31.360\nthat would really make a Hall of Fame leader?\n\n35\n00:01:31.360 --> 00:01:34.080\n- I think you're that rare individual\n\n36\n00:01:34.080 --> 00:01:37.360\nthat goes well beyond what the average person does.\n\n37\n00:01:37.360 --> 00:01:39.240\nAnd the way that you practice,\n\n38\n00:01:39.240 --> 00:01:40.360\nthe way that you show up,\n\n39\n00:01:40.360 --> 00:01:42.640\nthe way that you give to your team.\n\n40\n00:01:42.640 --> 00:01:47.440\nAnd that's exactly what Larry Fitzgerald is all about.\n\n41\n00:01:47.440 --> 00:01:49.160\n- Well, I know you spent a little time with Larry.\n\n42\n00:01:49.160 --> 00:01:50.720\nAll right, I'm assuming you have,\n\n43\n00:01:50.720 --> 00:01:53.980\nbecause he's usually out on the golf course all the time.\n\n44\n00:01:55.880 --> 00:01:58.720\n- Well, what's a golf story that's taught you\n\n45\n00:01:58.720 --> 00:02:01.200\nreally an important life lesson?\n\n46\n00:02:01.200 --> 00:02:05.160\n- One thing I realize very quickly is that\n\n47\n00:02:05.160 --> 00:02:07.880\nit doesn't matter how hard you hit the ball,\n\n48\n00:02:07.880 --> 00:02:11.320\nit's really about actually getting the ball into the hole.\n\n49\n00:02:11.320 --> 00:02:13.440\nAnd that's why I beat Larry so often.\n\n50\n00:02:13.440 --> 00:02:15.880\n(laughing)\n\n51\n00:02:15.880 --> 00:02:19.000\n- You and I have that in common, you know?\n\n52\n00:02:19.000 --> 00:02:22.760\nI have this picture of my office,\n\n53\n00:02:22.760 --> 00:02:27.760\nwhich is David, you know, out driving, you know, Goliath.\n\n54\n00:02:27.760 --> 00:02:30.080\nHe thought he actually had the longest drive\n\n55\n00:02:30.080 --> 00:02:33.680\nbut I had him by 40 yards and I sent him to him.\n\n56\n00:02:33.680 --> 00:02:36.040\nSo I don't think it's in his office\n\n57\n00:02:36.040 --> 00:02:37.600\nbut it certainly isn't mine.\n\n58\n00:02:37.600 --> 00:02:39.320\n- And you know, he's got to have some comments\n\n59\n00:02:39.320 --> 00:02:40.160\nabout this, I'm sure.\n\n60\n00:02:40.160 --> 00:02:44.760\n- Yeah, you know, I kind of joke half-jokingly\n\n61\n00:02:44.760 --> 00:02:47.360\nthat I'm not sure I'd have a lot of friends without golf.\n\n62\n00:02:47.360 --> 00:02:50.600\nI mean, I've met so many friends on the golf course.\n\n63\n00:02:50.600 --> 00:02:53.160\nAnd speaking of friends,\n\n64\n00:02:53.160 --> 00:02:56.760\nyou have what I think is a really awesome book\n\n65\n00:02:56.760 --> 00:03:01.760\nwith a real message everyone should read.\n\n66\n00:03:01.760 --> 00:03:03.800\nIt's called \"Friends of the Good.\"\n\n67\n00:03:03.800 --> 00:03:05.720\nYou know, where did the title come?\n\n68\n00:03:05.720 --> 00:03:06.720\nWhere did that phrase come?\n\n69\n00:03:06.720 --> 00:03:08.040\nFriends of the good?\n\n70\n00:03:08.040 --> 00:03:12.400\n- It actually comes from a really old set of writings\n\n71\n00:03:12.400 --> 00:03:16.280\nby Aristotle where many people don't realize\n\n72\n00:03:16.280 --> 00:03:18.920\nhe thought that friendship was one of the most essential\n\n73\n00:03:18.920 --> 00:03:21.760\nelements of joy and broke friendship\n\n74\n00:03:21.760 --> 00:03:24.280\ninto three categories.\n\n75\n00:03:24.280 --> 00:03:26.840\nTransactional, scratch my back, I scratch yours.\n\n76\n00:03:26.840 --> 00:03:29.760\nFriends of pleasure, we go out and party and hang out\n\n77\n00:03:29.760 --> 00:03:32.860\nbut both of those are fleeting in nature.\n\n78\n00:03:32.860 --> 00:03:35.960\nWhat he called \"Friends of the Good\" are \"Friends of Valor.\"\n\n79\n00:03:35.960 --> 00:03:37.560\nThose are the types of friendships\n\n80\n00:03:37.560 --> 00:03:39.760\nthat last for a lifetime.\n\n81\n00:03:39.760 --> 00:03:40.920\n- Yeah, how do you know,\n\n82\n00:03:40.920 --> 00:03:42.880\nDamon, whether a friend is going to be that?\n\n83\n00:03:42.880 --> 00:03:45.440\nI mean, how do you distinguish those?\n\n84\n00:03:45.440 --> 00:03:47.880\n- I think, quite frankly, people show you\n\n85\n00:03:47.880 --> 00:03:51.840\nwho they are every day and we oftentimes choose to ignore it.\n\n86\n00:03:51.840 --> 00:03:54.440\nHow your friends treat other people,\n\n87\n00:03:54.440 --> 00:03:55.960\nhow they treat a waiter,\n\n88\n00:03:55.960 --> 00:03:58.280\nthey might not treat you poorly in the moment\n\n89\n00:03:58.280 --> 00:04:01.560\nbut if you see them treating folks, you know, poorly\n\n90\n00:04:01.560 --> 00:04:04.600\notherwise that they don't need anything from\n\n91\n00:04:04.600 --> 00:04:06.520\nthen that's a clear indicator\n\n92\n00:04:06.520 --> 00:04:09.520\nor the opposite is \"Friends that show up.\"\n\n93\n00:04:09.520 --> 00:04:12.920\nYou know, they show up in times of joy\n\n94\n00:04:12.920 --> 00:04:15.160\nbut they also show up when you need to be comforted.\n\n95\n00:04:15.160 --> 00:04:17.200\nYou know, that's one of the biggest elements\n\n96\n00:04:17.200 --> 00:04:19.720\nof understanding a friend of the good.\n\n97\n00:04:19.720 --> 00:04:23.320\n- It sounds like they value you for who you are,\n\n98\n00:04:23.320 --> 00:04:25.480\nnot what you can do for them.\n\n99\n00:04:25.480 --> 00:04:26.320\n- Yeah, that's right.\n\n100\n00:04:26.320 --> 00:04:29.080\nNot transactional, not transactional, you know.\n\n101\n00:04:29.080 --> 00:04:32.640\nAnd I've also heard that you say you're not\n\n102\n00:04:32.640 --> 00:04:36.440\nnecessarily self-made, that your community built.\n\n103\n00:04:36.440 --> 00:04:39.400\nExplain what you mean by that.\n\n104\n00:04:39.400 --> 00:04:41.680\n- I mean, there's this false narrative\n\n105\n00:04:41.680 --> 00:04:45.040\nthat people pull themselves up by their bootstraps\n\n106\n00:04:45.040 --> 00:04:48.800\nand they become, you know, great successes.\n\n107\n00:04:48.800 --> 00:04:51.000\nI'm definitely not self-made.\n\n108\n00:04:51.000 --> 00:04:52.040\nI'm community built.\n\n109\n00:04:52.040 --> 00:04:55.240\nSo many people have poured into my life\n\n110\n00:04:55.240 --> 00:04:59.960\nat every stage of my life when I've needed it\n\n111\n00:04:59.960 --> 00:05:02.920\nto make me the human that I am.\n\n112\n00:05:02.920 --> 00:05:05.480\n- How do you stay in touch with those people or do you?\n\n113\n00:05:05.480 --> 00:05:09.120\n- I do, you know, even my fifth grade teacher, you know,\n\n114\n00:05:09.120 --> 00:05:11.880\nthat was so instrumental in my life.\n\n115\n00:05:11.880 --> 00:05:15.640\nMs. Johns, I've been able to text back and forth with her\n\n116\n00:05:15.640 --> 00:05:18.080\nand keep her up on my progress.\n\n117\n00:05:18.080 --> 00:05:19.560\nYou know, as I was writing this book,\n\n118\n00:05:19.560 --> 00:05:23.520\nI just, I thought about how transformational she was,\n\n119\n00:05:23.520 --> 00:05:24.920\nyou know, in my life.\n\n120\n00:05:24.920 --> 00:05:26.680\nIt's easier than most people think.\n\n121\n00:05:26.680 --> 00:05:28.760\nLike right now, there's somebody that's made\n\n122\n00:05:28.760 --> 00:05:30.440\nan extraordinary impact in your life.\n\n123\n00:05:30.440 --> 00:05:33.960\nI would ask, you know, just tell that person high.\n\n124\n00:05:33.960 --> 00:05:36.480\nYou know, send them a letter or send them a text\n\n125\n00:05:36.480 --> 00:05:38.160\nand just reconnect with them\n\n126\n00:05:38.160 --> 00:05:39.320\nand let them know you're thinking about them.\n\n127\n00:05:39.320 --> 00:05:40.360\nIt's important.\n\n128\n00:05:40.360 --> 00:05:42.160\n- Yeah, that's great.\n\n129\n00:05:42.160 --> 00:05:45.320\nYou know, and you mentioned your childhood teacher here.\n\n130\n00:05:45.320 --> 00:05:47.160\nYou know, I want to take you back\n\n131\n00:05:47.160 --> 00:05:49.080\nand maybe you tell a story about her,\n\n132\n00:05:49.080 --> 00:05:53.560\nbut what's a story from your childhood\n\n133\n00:05:53.560 --> 00:05:55.360\nor your upbringing that really shaped\n\n134\n00:05:55.360 --> 00:05:57.520\nthe kind of leader you are today?\n\n135\n00:05:57.520 --> 00:06:01.640\n- I was at times a bit of a class clown, you know,\n\n136\n00:06:01.640 --> 00:06:03.840\nback in fifth grade 'cause I would deflect.\n\n137\n00:06:03.840 --> 00:06:07.080\nIt turns out that I'm actually dyslexic and I didn't know.\n\n138\n00:06:07.080 --> 00:06:09.920\nWe didn't have the resources to test for that, you know,\n\n139\n00:06:09.920 --> 00:06:14.200\nback then, but Ms. Johns actually pulled me\n\n140\n00:06:14.200 --> 00:06:18.280\nto the side and recognized that I was talented at math.\n\n141\n00:06:18.280 --> 00:06:20.880\nLike, I couldn't spell very well in red, slow,\n\n142\n00:06:20.880 --> 00:06:25.360\nbut she gave me, you know, the academic confidence\n\n143\n00:06:25.360 --> 00:06:28.680\nby pointing out and honing my math skills,\n\n144\n00:06:28.680 --> 00:06:31.760\nwhich you which gave me the ability to have\n\n145\n00:06:31.760 --> 00:06:35.200\na reflection of myself that was positive academically\n\n146\n00:06:35.200 --> 00:06:37.520\nand no longer needed to be a class clown.\n\n147\n00:06:37.520 --> 00:06:38.600\nI'm still funny.\n\n148\n00:06:38.600 --> 00:06:40.240\n(both laugh)\n\n149\n00:06:40.240 --> 00:06:43.600\nBut not a class clown.\n\n150\n00:06:43.600 --> 00:06:46.400\n- Well, you know, speaking of funny, being funny,\n\n151\n00:06:46.400 --> 00:06:49.280\nhow important do you think humor is in leadership?\n\n152\n00:06:49.280 --> 00:06:52.440\n- I think it's very important.\n\n153\n00:06:52.440 --> 00:06:57.360\nThe ability to take something that could be super serious\n\n154\n00:06:57.360 --> 00:06:59.560\nor create, you know, a bunch of tension\n\n155\n00:06:59.560 --> 00:07:03.480\nand to be able to calm that down with a little bit of humor\n\n156\n00:07:03.480 --> 00:07:06.640\nand deflect, I think is an important, you know,\n\n157\n00:07:06.640 --> 00:07:09.920\nskill set and talent to have for sure.\n\n158\n00:07:09.920 --> 00:07:13.320\n- As I understand it, Devon, your first job out of college,\n\n159\n00:07:13.320 --> 00:07:15.640\nyou work for Erskine Bulls, who I know\n\n160\n00:07:15.640 --> 00:07:17.240\nand is a great, great person.\n\n161\n00:07:17.240 --> 00:07:19.640\nAnd he went, you know, obviously he became\n\n162\n00:07:19.640 --> 00:07:23.000\nthe President Clinton's White House Chief of Staff.\n\n163\n00:07:23.000 --> 00:07:25.280\nYou know, how did you end up working with Erskine?\n\n164\n00:07:25.280 --> 00:07:27.720\n- So I was elected student body president\n\n165\n00:07:27.720 --> 00:07:29.960\nas a sophomore at UNC Charlotte.\n\n166\n00:07:29.960 --> 00:07:32.480\nAnd my senior year of former student body president\n\n167\n00:07:32.480 --> 00:07:35.320\ncame to give a talk, so we got introduced.\n\n168\n00:07:35.320 --> 00:07:38.840\nAnd I already had a job at an accounting firm\n\n169\n00:07:38.840 --> 00:07:42.040\nafter graduation, but I said to her, as a throwaway comment,\n\n170\n00:07:42.040 --> 00:07:45.000\nlike, hey, you're working at the White House,\n\n171\n00:07:45.000 --> 00:07:47.080\nis there any way I could go there for the summer\n\n172\n00:07:47.080 --> 00:07:48.400\nbefore I start work?\n\n173\n00:07:48.400 --> 00:07:50.240\nAnd she said, sure, kids send me your resume.\n\n174\n00:07:50.240 --> 00:07:52.200\nSo got me into there.\n\n175\n00:07:52.200 --> 00:07:55.560\nI was a accounting major, everybody else is political science.\n\n176\n00:07:55.560 --> 00:07:58.480\nSo I was building spreadsheets during my internship\n\n177\n00:07:58.480 --> 00:08:02.200\nand then got recommended to work for Erskine\n\n178\n00:08:02.200 --> 00:08:03.240\nin a full-time job.\n\n179\n00:08:03.240 --> 00:08:07.560\nI remember walking from the old executive office building\n\n180\n00:08:07.560 --> 00:08:10.960\ninto the West Wing for the first time, passed the Marine.\n\n181\n00:08:10.960 --> 00:08:13.840\nAnd I walked into his office and he said,\n\n182\n00:08:13.840 --> 00:08:16.240\n\"Daman, I'm super busy.\n\n183\n00:08:16.240 --> 00:08:17.360\nI've heard a ton about you.\n\n184\n00:08:17.360 --> 00:08:18.840\nI'm very impressed.\n\n185\n00:08:18.840 --> 00:08:20.600\nCome work for me and I'll change your life.\"\n\n186\n00:08:20.600 --> 00:08:23.600\nAnd I was like, yeah, let's do that.\n\n187\n00:08:23.600 --> 00:08:25.560\nAnd so I ended up, you know, working with him\n\n188\n00:08:25.560 --> 00:08:27.480\nin a full-time position.\n\n189\n00:08:27.480 --> 00:08:29.880\nYou know, one other quick story is, you know,\n\n190\n00:08:29.880 --> 00:08:31.600\nsix months into that job,\n\n191\n00:08:31.600 --> 00:08:33.600\nI'm living on my fraternity brother's couch.\n\n192\n00:08:33.600 --> 00:08:35.160\nI've got no money.\n\n193\n00:08:35.160 --> 00:08:37.160\nI'm driving into the West Wing every day\n\n194\n00:08:37.160 --> 00:08:41.320\nin my 1990 Geo Prism and that thing breaks down,\n\n195\n00:08:41.320 --> 00:08:43.400\nsmokes blowing out of it.\n\n196\n00:08:43.400 --> 00:08:48.040\nAnd so now I go into work and I've got no car, no money.\n\n197\n00:08:48.040 --> 00:08:50.320\nAnd he hears about it.\n\n198\n00:08:50.320 --> 00:08:52.920\nAnd he said, you know, \"Daman, I'm living in this mansion\n\n199\n00:08:52.920 --> 00:08:55.240\nin Georgetown by myself.\n\n200\n00:08:55.240 --> 00:08:57.440\nWhy don't you just come live with me?\"\n\n201\n00:08:57.440 --> 00:09:01.840\nAnd again, I was like, yes, by doing that,\n\n202\n00:09:01.840 --> 00:09:05.160\nwe rode into work every day and we'd occasionally\n\n203\n00:09:05.160 --> 00:09:07.200\nshare a meal or watch a football game\n\n204\n00:09:07.200 --> 00:09:10.040\nand two people from very different backgrounds\n\n205\n00:09:10.040 --> 00:09:13.800\nthat on the surface look nothing alike.\n\n206\n00:09:13.800 --> 00:09:15.800\nWe found the humanity in each other\n\n207\n00:09:15.800 --> 00:09:17.880\nin a really extraordinary way\n\n208\n00:09:17.880 --> 00:09:20.200\nand he's become like my second father.\n\n209\n00:09:20.200 --> 00:09:23.080\nLike I've learned so much from him\n\n210\n00:09:23.080 --> 00:09:27.080\nand that car breaking down was one of the best events\n\n211\n00:09:27.080 --> 00:09:28.240\nin my life.\n\n212\n00:09:28.240 --> 00:09:33.000\n- Yeah, I mean, and how do you dig into the humanity\n\n213\n00:09:33.000 --> 00:09:35.080\nof other people as a leader?\n\n214\n00:09:35.080 --> 00:09:38.480\nHow do you make that a real asset for you?\n\n215\n00:09:38.480 --> 00:09:43.480\n- Be curious, you know, every human being\n\n216\n00:09:43.480 --> 00:09:47.640\ntheir greatest expertise is themselves, you know?\n\n217\n00:09:47.640 --> 00:09:52.240\nAnd so actually being interested in who they are,\n\n218\n00:09:52.240 --> 00:09:55.360\nwhat they believe, what they stand for,\n\n219\n00:09:55.360 --> 00:09:57.800\nwhat you're gonna realize is that, you know,\n\n220\n00:09:57.800 --> 00:10:00.120\nthe people across from you,\n\n221\n00:10:00.120 --> 00:10:02.920\nyou have so much more in common than you think.\n\n222\n00:10:02.920 --> 00:10:05.720\nI mean, we're in this time of isolation\n\n223\n00:10:05.720 --> 00:10:09.280\nand silo thinking and, you know,\n\n224\n00:10:09.280 --> 00:10:12.480\nwhat I would encourage folks to do is just not let,\n\n225\n00:10:12.480 --> 00:10:17.040\nyou know, race or age or income level be a barrier\n\n226\n00:10:17.040 --> 00:10:19.480\nto connecting with another human.\n\n227\n00:10:19.480 --> 00:10:24.480\n- You know, another thing that I read in my research\n\n228\n00:10:25.320 --> 00:10:30.320\nwas you described Erskine move from being more than just\n\n229\n00:10:30.320 --> 00:10:34.240\na mentor to becoming a sponsor, you know?\n\n230\n00:10:34.240 --> 00:10:37.680\nHow do those two interact and what's the difference?\n\n231\n00:10:37.680 --> 00:10:40.600\n- A mentor is somebody who writes a letter of recommendation.\n\n232\n00:10:40.600 --> 00:10:46.600\nA sponsor is someone who lends their credibility\n\n233\n00:10:46.600 --> 00:10:48.480\non your behalf.\n\n234\n00:10:48.480 --> 00:10:51.280\nYou know, when someone will call and ask or say,\n\n235\n00:10:51.280 --> 00:10:54.640\n\"Hey, I met this kid, Damani, said he worked for you,\n\n236\n00:10:54.640 --> 00:10:55.920\n\"what do you think?\"\n\n237\n00:10:55.920 --> 00:10:59.040\nErskine would say, \"Damani is my son.\"\n\n238\n00:10:59.040 --> 00:11:03.520\nRight, and that's a very different response.\n\n239\n00:11:03.520 --> 00:11:06.320\nYou know, he was like, \"Treat this young man\n\n240\n00:11:06.320 --> 00:11:07.960\n\"as you would my son.\"\n\n241\n00:11:07.960 --> 00:11:12.960\nAnd that credibility that he lent to me, you know,\n\n242\n00:11:12.960 --> 00:11:13.800\nwas extraordinary.\n\n243\n00:11:13.800 --> 00:11:17.000\nNow, I had a responsibility in that,\n\n244\n00:11:17.000 --> 00:11:18.760\nI had to do something with that.\n\n245\n00:11:18.760 --> 00:11:20.760\nI had to show up, I had to be respectful,\n\n246\n00:11:20.760 --> 00:11:24.200\nI had to work hard, and I had to honor\n\n247\n00:11:24.200 --> 00:11:27.400\nthat he gave, you know, that credibility to me.\n\n248\n00:11:27.400 --> 00:11:29.040\n- Putting that kind of positive pressure\n\n249\n00:11:29.040 --> 00:11:32.480\nreally had an impact on the accountability that you felt.\n\n250\n00:11:32.480 --> 00:11:36.480\nHow do you use that positive pressure in your repertoire\n\n251\n00:11:36.480 --> 00:11:37.920\nas you develop people?\n\n252\n00:11:37.920 --> 00:11:40.320\nDo you have a story when you've done that?\n\n253\n00:11:40.320 --> 00:11:42.880\n- Anyone who's come into my office\n\n254\n00:11:42.880 --> 00:11:48.360\nknows that I have one gear, you know, and it's honesty.\n\n255\n00:11:48.360 --> 00:11:49.200\n(laughs)\n\n256\n00:11:49.200 --> 00:11:52.000\nAnd so if, you know, there's been so many young folks\n\n257\n00:11:52.000 --> 00:11:55.160\nwho have come in and presented an idea,\n\n258\n00:11:55.160 --> 00:11:58.800\nand oftentimes what people will do is say,\n\n259\n00:11:58.800 --> 00:12:01.480\n\"Oh, that's great,\" or not really give much feedback,\n\n260\n00:12:01.480 --> 00:12:04.840\nbut I will tell you directly what I think.\n\n261\n00:12:04.840 --> 00:12:07.880\nIf it's a terrible idea, I'm gonna tell you it's terrible.\n\n262\n00:12:07.880 --> 00:12:10.040\nSome people don't respond well to that.\n\n263\n00:12:10.040 --> 00:12:12.080\nSome people don't respond well to feedback\n\n264\n00:12:12.080 --> 00:12:13.920\nthat's not positive anyway.\n\n265\n00:12:13.920 --> 00:12:18.400\nBut I think anyone that I've mentored over the years,\n\n266\n00:12:18.400 --> 00:12:21.640\nthey've grown to love that honesty\n\n267\n00:12:21.640 --> 00:12:26.640\nbecause it comes, it's with dignity, it's with respect,\n\n268\n00:12:26.640 --> 00:12:30.480\nbut it's honesty with love.\n\n269\n00:12:30.480 --> 00:12:34.200\n- You know, what advice, demon, do you get to aspiring leaders\n\n270\n00:12:34.200 --> 00:12:36.240\nwho are trying to earn opportunities?\n\n271\n00:12:36.240 --> 00:12:38.640\nI mean, you mentioned how you got to be, you know,\n\n272\n00:12:38.640 --> 00:12:40.880\nwork with the earth and bulls, you ask for it,\n\n273\n00:12:40.880 --> 00:12:43.440\nbut, you know, that seems pretty simple,\n\n274\n00:12:43.440 --> 00:12:45.920\nbut do you have more to the story\n\n275\n00:12:45.920 --> 00:12:48.880\nor just asking you shall receive?\n\n276\n00:12:48.880 --> 00:12:52.320\n- Some people are looking to have this five year plan\n\n277\n00:12:52.320 --> 00:12:54.600\nand once I go and then I do investment banking\n\n278\n00:12:54.600 --> 00:12:55.760\nand I'm gonna go to business school\n\n279\n00:12:55.760 --> 00:12:58.320\nand I'm gonna start a business,\n\n280\n00:12:58.320 --> 00:13:01.160\nI think that as a leader\n\n281\n00:13:01.160 --> 00:13:03.000\nand as someone who's learning from others,\n\n282\n00:13:03.000 --> 00:13:07.120\nyou surround yourself with the best possible people\n\n283\n00:13:07.120 --> 00:13:09.720\nwho have your interests, you know, at heart\n\n284\n00:13:09.720 --> 00:13:13.440\nand try to use, instead of chasing money,\n\n285\n00:13:13.440 --> 00:13:16.280\nchase knowledge and wisdom and experience,\n\n286\n00:13:16.280 --> 00:13:20.400\nI was just with an incredible leader this morning,\n\n287\n00:13:20.400 --> 00:13:23.280\nyou know, Westmore and one of the things that you said,\n\n288\n00:13:23.280 --> 00:13:27.600\nit was like, choose the tough things, you know,\n\n289\n00:13:27.600 --> 00:13:30.840\nbecause when you choose the path that makes you\n\n290\n00:13:30.840 --> 00:13:34.600\nstay up just a little bit longer\n\n291\n00:13:34.600 --> 00:13:37.160\nand get up a little bit earlier\n\n292\n00:13:37.160 --> 00:13:39.440\nand things are just a little bit harder,\n\n293\n00:13:39.440 --> 00:13:42.440\nit fortifies you, you know, for those moments\n\n294\n00:13:42.440 --> 00:13:45.240\nthat are inevitable, no one is spared\n\n295\n00:13:45.240 --> 00:13:49.440\nfrom, you know, tragedy or despair or hard things\n\n296\n00:13:49.440 --> 00:13:54.480\nand so rather than trying to constantly avoid\n\n297\n00:13:54.480 --> 00:13:56.720\nany of those things happening,\n\n298\n00:13:56.720 --> 00:14:00.720\npreparing yourself, understanding that it is inevitable\n\n299\n00:14:00.720 --> 00:14:04.000\nthat you're gonna experience a tough moment,\n\n300\n00:14:04.000 --> 00:14:06.200\nI think is the way to go.\n\n301\n00:14:06.200 --> 00:14:08.200\n- You know, another sponsor of yours,\n\n302\n00:14:08.200 --> 00:14:09.880\nI think that's probably the appropriate word,\n\n303\n00:14:09.880 --> 00:14:13.360\nnot mentor, it was James Cash\n\n304\n00:14:13.360 --> 00:14:14.960\nand who was he?\n\n305\n00:14:14.960 --> 00:14:17.480\nI don't think everybody would be necessarily familiar\n\n306\n00:14:17.480 --> 00:14:19.920\nwith him and what was it about him\n\n307\n00:14:19.920 --> 00:14:22.640\nthat made such a strong impression on you?\n\n308\n00:14:22.640 --> 00:14:27.640\n- Jim Cash is one of the greatest humans I've ever met.\n\n309\n00:14:27.640 --> 00:14:32.640\nHe integrated the basketball league he played in at TCU,\n\n310\n00:14:32.640 --> 00:14:37.560\nthere's a statue in front of TCU,\n\n311\n00:14:37.560 --> 00:14:41.800\nTexas Christian of him as a basketball player,\n\n312\n00:14:41.800 --> 00:14:44.480\nbut beyond that, he was original, you know,\n\n313\n00:14:44.480 --> 00:14:46.840\nMicrosoft board member,\n\n314\n00:14:46.840 --> 00:14:49.600\nhe's the first African American tenured professor\n\n315\n00:14:49.600 --> 00:14:53.760\nat Harvard Business School, Walmart board member,\n\n316\n00:14:53.760 --> 00:14:56.920\nbut more and more important than all those things,\n\n317\n00:14:56.920 --> 00:14:59.520\nhe's such a mentor to so many\n\n318\n00:14:59.520 --> 00:15:03.400\nand when I met him, I was a junior in college\n\n319\n00:15:03.400 --> 00:15:07.080\nand he's been a mentor to me, you know, to this day.\n\n320\n00:15:07.080 --> 00:15:08.280\n- Oh, that's great, you know,\n\n321\n00:15:08.280 --> 00:15:12.840\nas I understand his advice to you is basically think bigger,\n\n322\n00:15:12.840 --> 00:15:14.560\nyou know, yeah.\n\n323\n00:15:14.560 --> 00:15:16.120\n- I thought I was thinking pretty big.\n\n324\n00:15:16.120 --> 00:15:20.480\n- Yeah, tell me about a time where maybe he pushed you\n\n325\n00:15:20.480 --> 00:15:24.360\nor you pushed yourself to rise to that challenge\n\n326\n00:15:24.360 --> 00:15:25.960\nof thinking bigger.\n\n327\n00:15:25.960 --> 00:15:30.400\n- I mean, he's given me so much advice, you know,\n\n328\n00:15:30.400 --> 00:15:35.400\nthere was a public company that wanted me to be on their board\n\n329\n00:15:37.240 --> 00:15:40.000\nand he looked at me and he was like,\n\n330\n00:15:40.000 --> 00:15:40.960\n\"Why would you do that?\n\n331\n00:15:40.960 --> 00:15:43.480\n\"They need you more than you need them.\"\n\n332\n00:15:43.480 --> 00:15:48.480\nYou know, I mean, he's constantly that sort of sounding board,\n\n333\n00:15:48.480 --> 00:15:54.360\nhaving a mentor that truly knows you and your capabilities\n\n334\n00:15:54.360 --> 00:15:58.720\nand in moments of doubt or uncertainty can just, you know,\n\n335\n00:15:58.720 --> 00:16:03.280\ngive you that look is super important\n\n336\n00:16:03.280 --> 00:16:05.320\nto remind you who you are.\n\n337\n00:16:05.320 --> 00:16:08.040\n- That board example is a good one because it was obviously\n\n338\n00:16:08.040 --> 00:16:10.280\na board, it was a public company, but hey,\n\n339\n00:16:10.280 --> 00:16:12.000\nyou could do bigger things, you could go over,\n\n340\n00:16:12.000 --> 00:16:14.040\nmaybe you could learn a little bit more.\n\n341\n00:16:14.040 --> 00:16:17.400\nWhen did you push yourself to do something bigger?\n\n342\n00:16:17.400 --> 00:16:21.240\n- When I started well with all,\n\n343\n00:16:21.240 --> 00:16:24.480\nit was in a moment where, you know,\n\n344\n00:16:24.480 --> 00:16:27.640\nI'd had a 21-year career at one of the most successful\n\n345\n00:16:27.640 --> 00:16:32.640\nhedge funds in the world and we were in the middle of crisis.\n\n346\n00:16:33.280 --> 00:16:35.600\nI was standing in the middle of an emergency room\n\n347\n00:16:35.600 --> 00:16:39.040\nwith someone I love dealing with depression, anxiety,\n\n348\n00:16:39.040 --> 00:16:43.760\nsuicidal and in the worst moments of that,\n\n349\n00:16:43.760 --> 00:16:47.080\none of the things that I realized with the greatest clarity\n\n350\n00:16:47.080 --> 00:16:49.880\nis that now I was sitting on the other side of inequity.\n\n351\n00:16:49.880 --> 00:16:52.200\nYou know, growing up, I had a heroin addict\n\n352\n00:16:52.200 --> 00:16:54.120\nas a stepfather, I lived in poverty\n\n353\n00:16:54.120 --> 00:16:56.440\nand sort of went through the opportunities\n\n354\n00:16:56.440 --> 00:16:59.440\nof going to the White House and then Harvard Business School\n\n355\n00:16:59.440 --> 00:17:01.840\nand having an investment career.\n\n356\n00:17:01.840 --> 00:17:04.200\nBut now I'm sitting in this position\n\n357\n00:17:04.200 --> 00:17:06.840\nwhere I've got all this access\n\n358\n00:17:06.840 --> 00:17:09.000\nand the 14-year-old version of myself\n\n359\n00:17:09.000 --> 00:17:12.520\nhad I gone through that same scenario,\n\n360\n00:17:12.520 --> 00:17:15.760\nI'd be dead or in jail and there's so many people\n\n361\n00:17:15.760 --> 00:17:18.240\nthat are in that situation right now.\n\n362\n00:17:18.240 --> 00:17:21.000\nSo ultimately, what I ended up doing\n\n363\n00:17:21.000 --> 00:17:23.800\nis retiring from being an investor\n\n364\n00:17:23.800 --> 00:17:26.320\nand starting what is really a 2.0 version\n\n365\n00:17:26.320 --> 00:17:29.200\nof what Paul Newman created with Newman's own.\n\n366\n00:17:29.200 --> 00:17:31.800\nWell with all, we take 20% of the profits\n\n367\n00:17:31.800 --> 00:17:33.640\nand we use that to impact health equity,\n\n368\n00:17:33.640 --> 00:17:37.480\nbut we're working to put, you know, $300 million\n\n369\n00:17:37.480 --> 00:17:41.000\ninto helping communities, you know, over this next decade.\n\n370\n00:17:41.000 --> 00:17:45.520\nAnd so I've taken a bigger step to do something bigger.\n\n371\n00:17:45.520 --> 00:17:48.800\n- Yeah, that's a big, big time impact, Aaron.\n\n372\n00:17:48.800 --> 00:17:51.200\nAnd, you know, I wanna take you back\n\n373\n00:17:51.200 --> 00:17:54.200\nand we're gonna get more into your new company here.\n\n374\n00:17:54.200 --> 00:17:57.080\nWell with all.\n\n375\n00:17:57.080 --> 00:18:01.120\nBut tell us how you got into the investment business\n\n376\n00:18:01.120 --> 00:18:03.400\nand you said you've been done it for over 20 years\n\n377\n00:18:03.400 --> 00:18:04.800\nand you're at Adage Capital,\n\n378\n00:18:04.800 --> 00:18:08.120\nwhich is one of the largest hedge funds in the world.\n\n379\n00:18:08.120 --> 00:18:09.760\nHow did you end up there?\n\n380\n00:18:09.760 --> 00:18:14.760\n- When I was interviewing, coming out of business school,\n\n381\n00:18:14.760 --> 00:18:17.120\nyou know, a lot of people look for,\n\n382\n00:18:17.120 --> 00:18:19.920\nI wanna go work at a middle market private equity fund\n\n383\n00:18:19.920 --> 00:18:23.240\nor, you know, that does infrastructure.\n\n384\n00:18:23.240 --> 00:18:25.000\nI didn't have that specificity.\n\n385\n00:18:25.000 --> 00:18:27.680\nWhat I wanted to do was work for someone\n\n386\n00:18:27.680 --> 00:18:29.400\nwho had been extraordinarily successful\n\n387\n00:18:29.400 --> 00:18:31.520\nthat was willing to teach me\n\n388\n00:18:31.520 --> 00:18:35.520\nand allowed me to broaden my finance skills\n\n389\n00:18:35.520 --> 00:18:37.360\nand respected what I brought to the table.\n\n390\n00:18:37.360 --> 00:18:39.360\nLike that was my criteria.\n\n391\n00:18:39.360 --> 00:18:41.400\nAnd I ended up getting introduced\n\n392\n00:18:41.400 --> 00:18:44.360\nto a gentleman named Phil Gross,\n\n393\n00:18:44.360 --> 00:18:46.880\nwho really is a savant, you know,\n\n394\n00:18:46.880 --> 00:18:51.040\nan incredible investor, but an even better human.\n\n395\n00:18:51.040 --> 00:18:55.160\nAnd in that meeting, I called him five times\n\n396\n00:18:55.160 --> 00:18:57.840\nbefore he actually called me back and on the sixth time,\n\n397\n00:18:57.840 --> 00:19:00.080\nhe was like, hey, what are you doing tomorrow?\n\n398\n00:19:00.080 --> 00:19:02.160\nAnd I was like coming to see you and you're like, yeah.\n\n399\n00:19:02.160 --> 00:19:06.800\nSo I went over and we spent hours just talking.\n\n400\n00:19:06.800 --> 00:19:08.000\nWe talked about investments,\n\n401\n00:19:08.000 --> 00:19:09.360\nbut we talked about basketball.\n\n402\n00:19:09.360 --> 00:19:12.160\nWe talked about, you know, giving back to society.\n\n403\n00:19:12.160 --> 00:19:14.120\nAnd I realized like that's the person\n\n404\n00:19:14.120 --> 00:19:15.760\nthat I wanted to work for.\n\n405\n00:19:15.760 --> 00:19:18.720\nAnd I ended up, you know, working for him\n\n406\n00:19:18.720 --> 00:19:22.280\nand then becoming his business partner and, you know,\n\n407\n00:19:22.280 --> 00:19:25.200\nand he's been just a tremendous mentor.\n\n408\n00:19:25.200 --> 00:19:27.560\nHe taught me not only how to be an investor,\n\n409\n00:19:27.560 --> 00:19:29.880\nbut also how to be a philanthropist.\n\n410\n00:19:29.880 --> 00:19:31.840\n- When you're in the investment business like you,\n\n411\n00:19:31.840 --> 00:19:33.840\nor, you know, you got to put it, you know,\n\n412\n00:19:33.840 --> 00:19:38.080\nyou got to make some pretty hard decisions many, many times.\n\n413\n00:19:38.080 --> 00:19:40.040\nWhen you're evaluating the company,\n\n414\n00:19:40.040 --> 00:19:42.520\nwhat's the single biggest thing you look for?\n\n415\n00:19:42.520 --> 00:19:44.320\nWho are you going to put your money behind?\n\n416\n00:19:44.320 --> 00:19:46.600\n- It depends on the industry, right?\n\n417\n00:19:46.600 --> 00:19:49.800\nI mean, there's some industries like biotech\n\n418\n00:19:49.800 --> 00:19:51.960\nthat it's, you know, it's very specific.\n\n419\n00:19:51.960 --> 00:19:53.640\nLike, does a drug work or not?\n\n420\n00:19:53.640 --> 00:19:57.920\nYou know, that's going to drive the valuation.\n\n421\n00:19:57.920 --> 00:20:01.600\nIn the consumer industry, I spent a lot of time\n\n422\n00:20:01.600 --> 00:20:04.120\nunderstanding who was running the company.\n\n423\n00:20:04.120 --> 00:20:09.120\nA bad CFO and CEO could wreck a great company\n\n424\n00:20:09.120 --> 00:20:12.840\nand a great operation.\n\n425\n00:20:12.840 --> 00:20:16.560\nHow they managed inventory, how they dealt with expenses,\n\n426\n00:20:16.560 --> 00:20:20.600\nhow they dealt with the communication, you know,\n\n427\n00:20:20.600 --> 00:20:21.800\nof their guidance, you know,\n\n428\n00:20:21.800 --> 00:20:24.840\nall those things drove the business.\n\n429\n00:20:24.840 --> 00:20:28.440\nSo even, you know, really crappy industries,\n\n430\n00:20:28.440 --> 00:20:33.400\nyou can have extraordinary companies massively outperform.\n\n431\n00:20:33.400 --> 00:20:36.840\nSo there was a cocktail of opportunity,\n\n432\n00:20:36.840 --> 00:20:41.160\nbut also, you know, how the management team led.\n\n433\n00:20:41.160 --> 00:20:42.560\n- Hello friends.\n\n434\n00:20:42.560 --> 00:20:44.520\nI hope you're loving this conversation.\n\n435\n00:20:44.520 --> 00:20:46.920\nBe sure to stay tuned to the very end of the episode.\n\n436\n00:20:46.920 --> 00:20:49.200\nAs always, David and I are going to debrief\n\n437\n00:20:49.200 --> 00:20:51.080\nsome of the concepts that he talks about\n\n438\n00:20:51.080 --> 00:20:52.320\nwith this week's guests.\n\n439\n00:20:52.320 --> 00:20:56.400\nSo stay tuned to the very end, and I will see you soon.\n\n440\n00:20:56.400 --> 00:20:59.320\n- I love this quote of yours is which is, you know,\n\n441\n00:20:59.320 --> 00:21:01.960\nchoose the people, not the logo, you know.\n\n442\n00:21:01.960 --> 00:21:03.640\n(laughing)\n\n443\n00:21:03.640 --> 00:21:04.640\nSay more.\n\n444\n00:21:04.640 --> 00:21:11.000\n- Understanding who is the character of the people, you know,\n\n445\n00:21:14.200 --> 00:21:16.320\nwill determine the outcome.\n\n446\n00:21:16.320 --> 00:21:17.800\nThat's in a relationship.\n\n447\n00:21:17.800 --> 00:21:19.640\nThat's also in a business.\n\n448\n00:21:19.640 --> 00:21:23.040\n- And speaking of logos, you're wearing the logo\n\n449\n00:21:23.040 --> 00:21:27.600\non your hat here, and I'm holding up your well with all logo.\n\n450\n00:21:27.600 --> 00:21:30.440\nHow did you come to this logo?\n\n451\n00:21:30.440 --> 00:21:33.720\nAnd, you know, what was it that made you think\n\n452\n00:21:33.720 --> 00:21:37.160\nthis is the badge you wanted to put on your brand?\n\n453\n00:21:37.160 --> 00:21:39.280\n- Creating a logo is hard, by the way.\n\n454\n00:21:39.280 --> 00:21:43.600\nI didn't realize that finding a name in a logo\n\n455\n00:21:43.600 --> 00:21:46.280\nis a really difficult process.\n\n456\n00:21:46.280 --> 00:21:51.120\nBut what you see if you look intently enough,\n\n457\n00:21:51.120 --> 00:21:53.600\nthose are two hearts and three people,\n\n458\n00:21:53.600 --> 00:21:55.640\nand it's about love for a community, you know,\n\n459\n00:21:55.640 --> 00:21:58.320\nwhich is what well with all is all about.\n\n460\n00:21:58.320 --> 00:22:00.320\n- Love and the community, right?\n\n461\n00:22:00.320 --> 00:22:01.160\nThat's fantastic.\n\n462\n00:22:01.160 --> 00:22:04.760\nAnd, you know, tell us about well with all.\n\n463\n00:22:04.760 --> 00:22:07.080\nI mean, you mentioned a little bit, but I mean,\n\n464\n00:22:07.080 --> 00:22:09.280\nbut before you do, I mean,\n\n465\n00:22:09.280 --> 00:22:12.960\nwhat, you talked about the noble cause you had\n\n466\n00:22:12.960 --> 00:22:17.440\nbehind this business of giving back, which is terrific.\n\n467\n00:22:17.440 --> 00:22:20.720\nBut you were a person that sought out investments,\n\n468\n00:22:20.720 --> 00:22:23.880\nand you just said, \"I'm gonna flip the switch here.\"\n\n469\n00:22:23.880 --> 00:22:28.880\nOkay, what was it that really made you go,\n\n470\n00:22:28.880 --> 00:22:32.760\nyou know, I wanna start something,\n\n471\n00:22:32.760 --> 00:22:35.640\nrun something myself and do something\n\n472\n00:22:35.640 --> 00:22:38.400\nwhere people are gonna invest in me and my company?\n\n473\n00:22:38.400 --> 00:22:42.240\n- It really was the tragedy that we were living through\n\n474\n00:22:42.240 --> 00:22:47.040\nin our family, and when we started well with all,\n\n475\n00:22:47.040 --> 00:22:48.720\nit was never my intent to run it.\n\n476\n00:22:48.720 --> 00:22:53.720\nLike, I've helped start a number of things in the past\n\n477\n00:22:53.720 --> 00:22:59.400\nand helped others, you know, move forward with those.\n\n478\n00:22:59.400 --> 00:23:04.760\nIt got to a point where if this was ever gonna be\n\n479\n00:23:04.760 --> 00:23:07.360\nwhat it needed to be, I had to run it.\n\n480\n00:23:07.360 --> 00:23:10.600\nIt was my inspiration, it was my story,\n\n481\n00:23:10.600 --> 00:23:13.000\nit was my, you know, set of relationships\n\n482\n00:23:13.000 --> 00:23:15.400\nthat could really make this happen.\n\n483\n00:23:15.400 --> 00:23:17.680\nAnd so, you know, I had to run it,\n\n484\n00:23:17.680 --> 00:23:21.800\nbut it was not out of choice, quite frankly.\n\n485\n00:23:21.800 --> 00:23:24.320\nI was quite happy doing what I was doing,\n\n486\n00:23:24.320 --> 00:23:27.480\nbut this was, this is a life calling.\n\n487\n00:23:27.480 --> 00:23:30.800\n- And I assume you're really glad you took it on.\n\n488\n00:23:30.800 --> 00:23:34.120\n- I am, I wake up every day with the greatest clarity\n\n489\n00:23:34.120 --> 00:23:36.160\nthat I'm doing exactly what I should be doing,\n\n490\n00:23:36.160 --> 00:23:38.880\nand that feels pretty tremendous.\n\n491\n00:23:38.880 --> 00:23:41.480\n- What's been the biggest leadership challenge\n\n492\n00:23:41.480 --> 00:23:45.640\nthat you've had so far now that you're the person\n\n493\n00:23:45.640 --> 00:23:47.120\nthat people are investing in?\n\n494\n00:23:47.120 --> 00:23:52.720\n- People, I mean, any CEO will tell you,\n\n495\n00:23:52.720 --> 00:23:57.960\nit's all about the people, and it's the best thing,\n\n496\n00:23:57.960 --> 00:24:00.200\nyou know, about it, and it's the hardest thing,\n\n497\n00:24:00.200 --> 00:24:04.920\nparticularly when it's not going well,\n\n498\n00:24:04.920 --> 00:24:07.800\nand you have to fire someone.\n\n499\n00:24:07.800 --> 00:24:10.200\nThat is difficult because, you know,\n\n500\n00:24:10.200 --> 00:24:13.520\nwhat we've created it well with all is really a family,\n\n501\n00:24:13.520 --> 00:24:17.760\nand so every individual is part of this family,\n\n502\n00:24:17.760 --> 00:24:20.920\nbut there are moments when, you know,\n\n503\n00:24:20.920 --> 00:24:23.520\nthings aren't working the way that they need to,\n\n504\n00:24:23.520 --> 00:24:27.400\nand you have to adjust for the benefit of the greater good,\n\n505\n00:24:27.400 --> 00:24:28.760\nand that's tough.\n\n506\n00:24:28.760 --> 00:24:32.520\n- Tell us about the categories and the products\n\n507\n00:24:32.520 --> 00:24:35.520\nthat make up your brand.\n\n508\n00:24:35.520 --> 00:24:37.640\n- Yeah, you know, so one of my business partners\n\n509\n00:24:37.640 --> 00:24:39.400\nis the former CEO at GNC,\n\n510\n00:24:39.400 --> 00:24:43.320\nand so we started with a line of extraordinary,\n\n511\n00:24:43.320 --> 00:24:44.560\nyou know, supplements,\n\n512\n00:24:44.560 --> 00:24:46.080\nmen's and women's multivitamin,\n\n513\n00:24:46.080 --> 00:24:47.880\nincredible sleep product,\n\n514\n00:24:47.880 --> 00:24:50.080\nthe D3K2, you know, product,\n\n515\n00:24:50.080 --> 00:24:52.320\nand those are tremendous.\n\n516\n00:24:52.320 --> 00:24:53.640\nClinically studied ingredients\n\n517\n00:24:53.640 --> 00:24:55.360\nthat clinically studied dosages,\n\n518\n00:24:55.360 --> 00:25:00.360\nand then we also launched a natural energy drink\n\n519\n00:25:00.360 --> 00:25:03.040\nthat is phenomenal, it tastes great,\n\n520\n00:25:03.040 --> 00:25:04.280\nit's only 80 milligrams again.\n\n521\n00:25:04.280 --> 00:25:05.360\n- It is unbelievable, we're good,\n\n522\n00:25:05.360 --> 00:25:07.240\nit's only 45 calories, it's really good.\n\n523\n00:25:07.240 --> 00:25:11.160\nI love this, you know, the mango, the mango is that, man.\n\n524\n00:25:11.160 --> 00:25:13.240\nThat's, you crushed it with the mango,\n\n525\n00:25:13.240 --> 00:25:15.280\nI like them all, strawberry lemonade, it's good.\n\n526\n00:25:15.280 --> 00:25:17.280\n- Strawberry, I got this strawberry lemonade,\n\n527\n00:25:17.280 --> 00:25:20.480\nbut why would a wellness company, you know,\n\n528\n00:25:20.480 --> 00:25:22.800\nstart an energy drink?\n\n529\n00:25:22.800 --> 00:25:25.960\nOne of the highest caloric impacts to the American diet\n\n530\n00:25:25.960 --> 00:25:27.920\nis sugary sodas and drinks,\n\n531\n00:25:27.920 --> 00:25:31.680\nand so having a substitute, you know, for that\n\n532\n00:25:31.680 --> 00:25:33.040\nis extraordinarily important.\n\n533\n00:25:33.040 --> 00:25:34.520\nThis is only 45 calories,\n\n534\n00:25:34.520 --> 00:25:37.800\nand it comes from the 30% real fruit and vegetable juice,\n\n535\n00:25:37.800 --> 00:25:39.800\nand it tastes fantastic.\n\n536\n00:25:39.800 --> 00:25:42.120\n- It tastes like it's loaded with sugar.\n\n537\n00:25:42.120 --> 00:25:43.160\n- But it's not, right?\n\n538\n00:25:43.160 --> 00:25:45.320\nIt's no added sugar whatsoever.\n\n539\n00:25:45.320 --> 00:25:48.200\nBut, you know, the sugary soda industry\n\n540\n00:25:48.200 --> 00:25:50.920\nis a $54 billion industry, right?\n\n541\n00:25:50.920 --> 00:25:55.120\nSo we also are quite strategic in terms of thinking about\n\n542\n00:25:55.120 --> 00:25:58.280\nhow we grow this business to generate the profits\n\n543\n00:25:58.280 --> 00:25:59.920\nto do the help in community.\n\n544\n00:25:59.920 --> 00:26:02.600\n- What do you understand about your customers\n\n545\n00:26:02.600 --> 00:26:05.720\nthat maybe the big, big wellness brands don't?\n\n546\n00:26:05.720 --> 00:26:09.600\n- The big wellness brands have not been talking\n\n547\n00:26:09.600 --> 00:26:10.960\nto communities of color,\n\n548\n00:26:10.960 --> 00:26:15.160\nhave not been talking to folks who don't make\n\n549\n00:26:15.160 --> 00:26:18.520\na super high income,\n\n550\n00:26:18.520 --> 00:26:21.880\nand what we've been doing is democratizing\n\n551\n00:26:21.880 --> 00:26:26.600\nnot only healthy products, but also health information.\n\n552\n00:26:26.600 --> 00:26:29.880\nSo, you know, what you'll see very shortly,\n\n553\n00:26:29.880 --> 00:26:33.680\nwe're launching with Walmart in October,\n\n554\n00:26:33.680 --> 00:26:37.000\nand we're gonna be bringing health information\n\n555\n00:26:37.000 --> 00:26:40.560\nto the pharmacies within Walmart.\n\n556\n00:26:40.560 --> 00:26:42.720\nStarting first in Boston, in Chicago,\n\n557\n00:26:42.720 --> 00:26:45.720\nwe've got something called know your numbers,\n\n558\n00:26:45.720 --> 00:26:48.480\nchange your life, which are the six numbers\n\n559\n00:26:48.480 --> 00:26:50.360\nthat every human, you know,\n\n560\n00:26:50.360 --> 00:26:52.680\nshould know to live a longer, healthier life.\n\n561\n00:26:52.680 --> 00:26:55.080\nAnd, you know, things like A1C,\n\n562\n00:26:55.080 --> 00:26:58.520\nwhere 80% of people who are prediabetic\n\n563\n00:26:58.520 --> 00:27:01.240\nhave no idea that that's the case.\n\n564\n00:27:01.240 --> 00:27:03.800\nAnd you wonder why people are having strokes\n\n565\n00:27:03.800 --> 00:27:05.800\nand heart attacks and so forth,\n\n566\n00:27:05.800 --> 00:27:08.640\nbecause these silent killers are creeping up on them\n\n567\n00:27:08.640 --> 00:27:10.000\nwithout the knowledge.\n\n568\n00:27:10.000 --> 00:27:13.440\nSo, getting also great health information to folks\n\n569\n00:27:13.440 --> 00:27:16.560\nis a big part of what Wellwithal's doing.\n\n570\n00:27:16.560 --> 00:27:18.960\n- Do you involve customers in your product development?\n\n571\n00:27:18.960 --> 00:27:21.200\nDo you do anything unique on that front?\n\n572\n00:27:21.200 --> 00:27:25.600\n- Yeah, we, you know, particularly with the drink,\n\n573\n00:27:25.600 --> 00:27:30.360\nlike we went out and we extended the process\n\n574\n00:27:30.360 --> 00:27:34.560\nby over a month beyond what is typically done\n\n575\n00:27:34.560 --> 00:27:36.880\nto bring in unique voices and make sure\n\n576\n00:27:36.880 --> 00:27:38.200\nthat we had a diverse, you know,\n\n577\n00:27:38.200 --> 00:27:42.840\nset of folks who tasted the drinks and gave us feedback.\n\n578\n00:27:42.840 --> 00:27:44.360\nAnd then we made adjustments\n\n579\n00:27:44.360 --> 00:27:46.520\nbefore those products came to market.\n\n580\n00:27:46.520 --> 00:27:49.680\nWe do a ton of sampling, you know, around the country\n\n581\n00:27:49.680 --> 00:27:51.520\nand we get feedback from customers\n\n582\n00:27:51.520 --> 00:27:54.920\nand we've got some products in the pipeline\n\n583\n00:27:54.920 --> 00:27:58.400\nthat are directly based on the customer feedback.\n\n584\n00:27:58.400 --> 00:28:00.360\n- Did they teach you something that really surprised you\n\n585\n00:28:00.360 --> 00:28:02.000\nas you were getting their feedback on the,\n\n586\n00:28:02.000 --> 00:28:03.800\nlet's just take the energy drink?\n\n587\n00:28:03.800 --> 00:28:08.800\n- You know, the nostalgia that people, you know, wanted,\n\n588\n00:28:08.800 --> 00:28:11.640\nlike when you taste the fruit punch,\n\n589\n00:28:11.640 --> 00:28:14.280\nit tastes like something that you drink as a kid,\n\n590\n00:28:14.280 --> 00:28:16.720\nbut it's a hell of a lot healthier.\n\n591\n00:28:16.720 --> 00:28:17.560\nThat was one--\n\n592\n00:28:17.560 --> 00:28:19.160\n- It's like Hawaiian punch.\n\n593\n00:28:19.160 --> 00:28:21.480\nI mean, that's what it tastes like if you like it.\n\n594\n00:28:21.480 --> 00:28:24.080\nAnd then I look at 45 calories, you gotta be kidding me.\n\n595\n00:28:24.080 --> 00:28:25.520\n(laughs)\n\n596\n00:28:25.520 --> 00:28:26.360\n- It's really good.\n\n597\n00:28:26.360 --> 00:28:30.560\nSo, but, so I think also the desire for people to,\n\n598\n00:28:30.560 --> 00:28:33.240\nwhen they have something that is a healthier alternative\n\n599\n00:28:33.240 --> 00:28:36.440\nand it tastes good that they're willing to switch\n\n600\n00:28:36.440 --> 00:28:38.960\nfrom the stuff that they were putting in their bodies.\n\n601\n00:28:38.960 --> 00:28:41.120\n- Now, you said something earlier that really stood out\n\n602\n00:28:41.120 --> 00:28:46.120\nto be, you give 20% of your profits into health equity.\n\n603\n00:28:46.120 --> 00:28:49.160\nWhat the heck is health equity?\n\n604\n00:28:49.160 --> 00:28:54.060\nAnd this is, I'm sure part of doing good in the world,\n\n605\n00:28:54.060 --> 00:28:54.900\nbut--\n\n606\n00:28:54.900 --> 00:28:59.220\n- So, you know, if you look in this country,\n\n607\n00:28:59.220 --> 00:29:04.220\nin the last 15 years, 140 rural hospitals have been closed.\n\n608\n00:29:04.220 --> 00:29:10.180\nSince 2022, on average, 17 veterans a day\n\n609\n00:29:10.180 --> 00:29:12.300\nhave committed suicide.\n\n610\n00:29:12.300 --> 00:29:14.380\nIf you look here in Boston,\n\n611\n00:29:14.380 --> 00:29:18.340\nBack Bay versus Roxbury,\n\n612\n00:29:18.340 --> 00:29:21.280\nthere's a 23-year life expectancy gap that exists\n\n613\n00:29:21.280 --> 00:29:24.040\nbetween those two places, and they're three miles\n\n614\n00:29:24.040 --> 00:29:25.040\naway from each other.\n\n615\n00:29:25.040 --> 00:29:28.120\nThe north side of Chicago versus the south side of Chicago,\n\n616\n00:29:28.120 --> 00:29:30.440\nthere's a 30-year life expectancy gap.\n\n617\n00:29:30.440 --> 00:29:34.920\nSo, people are living shorter, sicker lives, you know,\n\n618\n00:29:34.920 --> 00:29:39.160\nin places that are determined by their zip code,\n\n619\n00:29:39.160 --> 00:29:41.840\nas opposed to who they are as humans.\n\n620\n00:29:41.840 --> 00:29:46.840\nAnd so, getting information, getting healthier food,\n\n621\n00:29:47.080 --> 00:29:50.880\ngetting access, you know, to these communities\n\n622\n00:29:50.880 --> 00:29:54.560\nthat are in the United States, right across the street,\n\n623\n00:29:54.560 --> 00:29:56.360\nright down the road, you know,\n\n624\n00:29:56.360 --> 00:29:58.040\nfrom where people are living, you know,\n\n625\n00:29:58.040 --> 00:30:01.560\nsuper long, healthy lives is a part of the process.\n\n626\n00:30:01.560 --> 00:30:04.200\nWe can actually close these gaps\n\n627\n00:30:04.200 --> 00:30:06.560\nwith just a little bit of intervention\n\n628\n00:30:06.560 --> 00:30:08.280\nand some hard work and effort and energy.\n\n629\n00:30:08.280 --> 00:30:09.720\nAnd that's what well with all is doing.\n\n630\n00:30:09.720 --> 00:30:13.080\n- And, you know, going back to the idea of thinking big,\n\n631\n00:30:13.080 --> 00:30:15.280\nyou know, you've set this incredible goal\n\n632\n00:30:15.280 --> 00:30:19.960\nof creating $300 million of impact,\n\n633\n00:30:19.960 --> 00:30:23.560\nyou know, I think he's broadly defined over the next decade.\n\n634\n00:30:23.560 --> 00:30:26.000\nHuge and hats off to you for doing that.\n\n635\n00:30:26.000 --> 00:30:28.005\nBut how do you, what have you learned\n\n636\n00:30:28.005 --> 00:30:31.245\nor how do you take such a big vision like that\n\n637\n00:30:31.245 --> 00:30:35.285\nand get it into an executable plan?\n\n638\n00:30:35.285 --> 00:30:37.485\nHow do you make it a reality?\n\n639\n00:30:37.485 --> 00:30:41.525\n- You start with one thing and then you make it work\n\n640\n00:30:41.525 --> 00:30:43.285\nand you start with the next thing\n\n641\n00:30:43.285 --> 00:30:47.165\nand you bring in super talented people\n\n642\n00:30:47.165 --> 00:30:49.685\nto help you where you don't have expertise.\n\n643\n00:30:49.685 --> 00:30:51.125\nAnd so I'll give you an example.\n\n644\n00:30:51.125 --> 00:30:54.245\nYou know, we have something called a million dollar well\n\n645\n00:30:54.245 --> 00:30:58.445\nwith all prize that October 15th will give away a million\n\n646\n00:30:58.445 --> 00:31:02.685\ndollars to AI innovations that are closing health equity gaps.\n\n647\n00:31:02.685 --> 00:31:06.605\nAnd folks like M&T Bank, you know, have joined in, you know,\n\n648\n00:31:06.605 --> 00:31:09.365\nwith us to do this really, really well.\n\n649\n00:31:09.365 --> 00:31:12.605\nThe president of Bechtel, you know, has come out\n\n650\n00:31:12.605 --> 00:31:14.125\nand helped us.\n\n651\n00:31:14.125 --> 00:31:18.085\nThere's so many incredible folks who want to do good, you know,\n\n652\n00:31:18.085 --> 00:31:21.885\nso if you have great ideas and you have executable ideas,\n\n653\n00:31:21.885 --> 00:31:23.885\nyou know, I think that there's just a ton of people\n\n654\n00:31:23.885 --> 00:31:25.285\nthat are willing to join you.\n\n655\n00:31:25.285 --> 00:31:27.965\nBut we're focused on a few things\n\n656\n00:31:27.965 --> 00:31:29.845\nand we're doing them really well\n\n657\n00:31:29.845 --> 00:31:32.365\nand then we'll keep doing that over and over again.\n\n658\n00:31:32.365 --> 00:31:36.485\n- How is, how did your background in investing,\n\n659\n00:31:36.485 --> 00:31:40.245\nhow have you translated and made that a real advantage\n\n660\n00:31:40.245 --> 00:31:43.645\nfor you as a CEO and founder?\n\n661\n00:31:43.645 --> 00:31:46.565\n- Living the life that I live, the trauma that I live,\n\n662\n00:31:46.565 --> 00:31:50.245\nquite frankly, early in life, I had to recognize\n\n663\n00:31:50.245 --> 00:31:52.765\nwas someone here to help or harm, right?\n\n664\n00:31:52.765 --> 00:31:54.245\nAnd when I walked through the streets,\n\n665\n00:31:54.245 --> 00:31:57.565\nwhen I got on the bus, you know, those were life skills\n\n666\n00:31:57.565 --> 00:31:58.405\nthat I developed.\n\n667\n00:31:58.405 --> 00:32:00.845\nAnd those things actually end up being incredibly,\n\n668\n00:32:00.845 --> 00:32:04.525\nthose instincts end up being incredibly useful in business.\n\n669\n00:32:04.525 --> 00:32:07.525\nAnd so investing in people and understanding\n\n670\n00:32:07.525 --> 00:32:12.285\nand evaluating people for over 21 years in that way\n\n671\n00:32:12.285 --> 00:32:14.845\nalso helps you, you know, pick great teammates\n\n672\n00:32:14.845 --> 00:32:17.605\nand bring people in that are smarter than you\n\n673\n00:32:17.605 --> 00:32:21.085\nabout all the things that are needed to run an effective\n\n674\n00:32:21.085 --> 00:32:24.925\nand efficient business, you know, has served me well as a CEO.\n\n675\n00:32:24.925 --> 00:32:27.525\n- And I'm sure over the years, you invested in some\n\n676\n00:32:27.525 --> 00:32:31.605\nembryonic consumer companies and what did you learn\n\n677\n00:32:31.605 --> 00:32:34.525\nby watching them and just watching what's going on\n\n678\n00:32:34.525 --> 00:32:39.365\nin industry's period that you're using now\n\n679\n00:32:39.365 --> 00:32:43.125\nas you scale your business because you just mentioned\n\n680\n00:32:43.125 --> 00:32:45.925\nyou're just going into Walmart with your energy drink,\n\n681\n00:32:45.925 --> 00:32:48.765\nyou know, what have you learned about scaling as a leader\n\n682\n00:32:48.765 --> 00:32:50.805\nand how to do it right?\n\n683\n00:32:50.805 --> 00:32:53.525\n- You know, so one of the things that we've done\n\n684\n00:32:53.525 --> 00:32:57.045\nhighly effectively is we've gone into two markets.\n\n685\n00:32:57.045 --> 00:32:59.605\nWe're driving productivity and density.\n\n686\n00:32:59.605 --> 00:33:03.005\nAnd then we're growing from there as opposed to saying,\n\n687\n00:33:03.005 --> 00:33:06.405\nlet's go nationwide, you know, where there's, you know,\n\n688\n00:33:06.405 --> 00:33:09.445\ncities and towns that have never heard of our brand\n\n689\n00:33:09.445 --> 00:33:12.365\nwhere we, you know, wouldn't spend the marketing dollars\n\n690\n00:33:12.365 --> 00:33:14.205\nand then your product is just sitting on the shelf.\n\n691\n00:33:14.205 --> 00:33:16.525\nAnd so we've been super thoughtful\n\n692\n00:33:16.525 --> 00:33:19.645\nabout the execution plan and studying.\n\n693\n00:33:19.645 --> 00:33:22.805\nOne of the things that I always, you know, tell young folks\n\n694\n00:33:22.805 --> 00:33:26.925\nwho, you know, who watch your podcast\n\n695\n00:33:26.925 --> 00:33:30.485\nis there's a case study out there of some form\n\n696\n00:33:30.485 --> 00:33:33.245\nof what you're trying to do to be studied and learned from.\n\n697\n00:33:33.245 --> 00:33:35.365\nEven if it's the wrong things to do,\n\n698\n00:33:35.365 --> 00:33:38.605\nunderstanding, you know, the people that have come before you,\n\n699\n00:33:38.605 --> 00:33:41.085\nyou know, and the things that they've tried,\n\n700\n00:33:41.085 --> 00:33:44.325\nthere's no need to fall into those same potholes\n\n701\n00:33:44.325 --> 00:33:45.405\nwhen they've been mapped out.\n\n702\n00:33:45.405 --> 00:33:49.845\nAnd so we've been very effective at looking at the models\n\n703\n00:33:49.845 --> 00:33:52.525\nthat have been effective and that have failed.\n\n704\n00:33:52.525 --> 00:33:55.045\nAnd then acted accordingly.\n\n705\n00:33:55.045 --> 00:33:56.725\n- Well, you know, one thing right now,\n\n706\n00:33:56.725 --> 00:33:59.325\nDemond, that's, you know, better than me\n\n707\n00:33:59.325 --> 00:34:02.125\nis that AI is changing almost everything.\n\n708\n00:34:02.125 --> 00:34:05.645\nAnd what are you learning about AI right now\n\n709\n00:34:05.645 --> 00:34:09.845\nthat you think other leaders could benefit from?\n\n710\n00:34:09.845 --> 00:34:12.965\n- Well, one, I think if you look on average,\n\n711\n00:34:12.965 --> 00:34:17.565\nlike the folks who are in their mid to late 30s\n\n712\n00:34:17.565 --> 00:34:21.325\nand above are not using this technology\n\n713\n00:34:21.325 --> 00:34:23.205\neven remotely close to the power\n\n714\n00:34:23.205 --> 00:34:25.845\nthat it can offer them, you know, for their businesses.\n\n715\n00:34:25.845 --> 00:34:29.765\nAnd so the first thing is to dive in heavy\n\n716\n00:34:29.765 --> 00:34:33.605\nand understand what the capacity and the power is.\n\n717\n00:34:33.605 --> 00:34:35.965\nYou know, one of my friends, Kareem Lakhani,\n\n718\n00:34:35.965 --> 00:34:39.125\nwho runs the AI lab at Harvard Business School,\n\n719\n00:34:39.125 --> 00:34:44.125\nhe asked CEOs to use the technology themselves every day.\n\n720\n00:34:44.125 --> 00:34:48.245\nYou can't lead an institution\n\n721\n00:34:48.245 --> 00:34:50.525\nand tell people to go off and do it.\n\n722\n00:34:50.525 --> 00:34:54.325\nIf you're not actually engaging in the power of this.\n\n723\n00:34:54.325 --> 00:34:59.205\nAnd so I think the first step is really to use it\n\n724\n00:34:59.205 --> 00:35:04.205\nand to discover how it can unlock the value of your business.\n\n725\n00:35:04.205 --> 00:35:07.365\nI don't think that for us that this technology\n\n726\n00:35:07.365 --> 00:35:11.085\nis replacing, you know, people,\n\n727\n00:35:11.085 --> 00:35:15.685\nwhat it's doing is it's helping me identify the people\n\n728\n00:35:15.685 --> 00:35:18.885\nwho actually can use this technology for our benefit\n\n729\n00:35:18.885 --> 00:35:22.045\nand it's accelerating, you know, our work.\n\n730\n00:35:22.045 --> 00:35:25.485\n- You know, getting back to people again\n\n731\n00:35:25.485 --> 00:35:27.725\n'cause you keep coming back to that.\n\n732\n00:35:27.725 --> 00:35:32.725\nYou know, do you have any questions that you ask people\n\n733\n00:35:32.725 --> 00:35:35.285\nor if you're interviewing somebody,\n\n734\n00:35:35.285 --> 00:35:39.485\nhow do you get at the humanity?\n\n735\n00:35:39.485 --> 00:35:42.125\nYou know, 'cause, you know, you've mentioned that word a lot\n\n736\n00:35:42.125 --> 00:35:43.405\nand that's important to you.\n\n737\n00:35:43.405 --> 00:35:45.245\nI mean, you're looking for humanity\n\n738\n00:35:45.245 --> 00:35:48.485\nin the business that you build, people that you hire,\n\n739\n00:35:48.485 --> 00:35:51.245\nyou know, give us some insight\n\n740\n00:35:51.245 --> 00:35:53.325\nhow you really get at that.\n\n741\n00:35:53.325 --> 00:35:56.685\n- Understanding what people's true interests are\n\n742\n00:35:56.685 --> 00:35:59.965\nand asking them about, you know, what their interests are,\n\n743\n00:35:59.965 --> 00:36:04.005\nwhat do they do, what activities outside of work\n\n744\n00:36:04.005 --> 00:36:06.405\ndo they engage in, you know,\n\n745\n00:36:06.405 --> 00:36:10.365\nhelps you understand what they're about.\n\n746\n00:36:10.365 --> 00:36:12.205\nI also think that a really important point\n\n747\n00:36:12.205 --> 00:36:15.445\nthat you made earlier about golf\n\n748\n00:36:15.445 --> 00:36:19.205\nis one of the pieces of advice that I give young people.\n\n749\n00:36:19.205 --> 00:36:22.165\nI often ask a room, like, how many people here play golf\n\n750\n00:36:22.165 --> 00:36:24.405\nand in many of the rooms, it's, you know,\n\n751\n00:36:24.405 --> 00:36:26.205\na very small percentage.\n\n752\n00:36:26.205 --> 00:36:30.285\nAnd I ask them to think about the three people\n\n753\n00:36:30.285 --> 00:36:33.285\nin the world that they would most like to learn from.\n\n754\n00:36:33.285 --> 00:36:36.205\nThen they get the idea of that and I say, well, you know,\n\n755\n00:36:36.205 --> 00:36:37.845\nif you were to get a meeting with them,\n\n756\n00:36:37.845 --> 00:36:41.645\nit would likely be a Zoom and it'd be 30 minutes.\n\n757\n00:36:41.645 --> 00:36:45.685\nAnd, but if you were so lucky to play golf\n\n758\n00:36:45.685 --> 00:36:48.885\nwith that same person,\n\n759\n00:36:48.885 --> 00:36:50.925\nyou could be together six hours.\n\n760\n00:36:50.925 --> 00:36:54.925\nYou know, if you throw in a meal and a drink afterwards,\n\n761\n00:36:54.925 --> 00:36:56.685\nthat's 12 beatings.\n\n762\n00:36:56.685 --> 00:36:59.125\nYou're not gonna get 12 meetings with anyone in five years.\n\n763\n00:36:59.125 --> 00:37:02.245\nAnd so the knowledge transfer that can happen\n\n764\n00:37:02.245 --> 00:37:05.725\nin a game of golf, the wisdom that can be imparted,\n\n765\n00:37:05.725 --> 00:37:08.685\nbut also the understanding of the human,\n\n766\n00:37:08.685 --> 00:37:11.805\ndoes he or she cheat, right?\n\n767\n00:37:11.805 --> 00:37:14.765\nAre they angry, you know, during the whole round\n\n768\n00:37:14.765 --> 00:37:16.365\nwhen they make a mistake,\n\n769\n00:37:16.365 --> 00:37:19.885\nyou learn so much about the humanity of the person\n\n770\n00:37:19.885 --> 00:37:20.765\nin a game of golf.\n\n771\n00:37:20.765 --> 00:37:23.685\nIt's one of my favorite things to do with people\n\n772\n00:37:23.685 --> 00:37:27.245\nthat I wanna do something, you know, big with.\n\n773\n00:37:27.245 --> 00:37:28.325\n- I love your question.\n\n774\n00:37:28.325 --> 00:37:30.205\nYou know, what three leaders would you,\n\n775\n00:37:30.205 --> 00:37:31.645\nwould you wanna learn from?\n\n776\n00:37:31.645 --> 00:37:34.285\nDo you have your three that you'd love to learn from?\n\n777\n00:37:34.285 --> 00:37:35.485\n- Living or debt?\n\n778\n00:37:35.485 --> 00:37:36.965\n- You answered any way you want.\n\n779\n00:37:36.965 --> 00:37:38.805\nI gave you a lot of flax there.\n\n780\n00:37:38.805 --> 00:37:41.005\n(laughing)\n\n781\n00:37:41.005 --> 00:37:44.965\n- That's a really, I've been fortunate to spend time\n\n782\n00:37:44.965 --> 00:37:46.965\nwith some amazing folks.\n\n783\n00:37:46.965 --> 00:37:49.805\nI think Muhammad Ali was one of the most, you know,\n\n784\n00:37:49.805 --> 00:37:54.805\nfascinating humans that I've had a chance to witness\n\n785\n00:37:54.805 --> 00:37:59.125\nbut never met.\n\n786\n00:37:59.125 --> 00:38:03.965\nPresident Obama is just an extraordinary,\n\n787\n00:38:03.965 --> 00:38:07.325\nextraordinary human.\n\n788\n00:38:07.325 --> 00:38:11.565\nAnd then I think I would round that off.\n\n789\n00:38:11.565 --> 00:38:13.165\nI'll go with Jesus.\n\n790\n00:38:13.165 --> 00:38:14.525\n(laughing)\n\n791\n00:38:14.525 --> 00:38:15.845\nWell, you know one thing,\n\n792\n00:38:15.845 --> 00:38:17.245\nhe'd make a lot of hole at once,\n\n793\n00:38:17.245 --> 00:38:18.565\nthere's no doubt about that.\n\n794\n00:38:18.565 --> 00:38:20.805\n(laughing)\n\n795\n00:38:20.805 --> 00:38:24.045\nYou know, you were talking about AI a little bit earlier\n\n796\n00:38:24.045 --> 00:38:25.245\nbut you gotta use it.\n\n797\n00:38:25.245 --> 00:38:27.125\nYou know, you gotta use it to understand it.\n\n798\n00:38:27.125 --> 00:38:29.045\nYou know, what would be, I'm curious,\n\n799\n00:38:29.045 --> 00:38:31.445\nwhat would be in your AI stack today?\n\n800\n00:38:31.445 --> 00:38:36.445\nThe capabilities that have come from Claude\n\n801\n00:38:36.445 --> 00:38:41.525\nin the last, you know, call it four to six months\n\n802\n00:38:41.525 --> 00:38:43.005\nhas been really extraordinary.\n\n803\n00:38:43.005 --> 00:38:45.525\nIt's been a step function\n\n804\n00:38:45.525 --> 00:38:48.845\nthat I didn't expect to happen, you know, this quickly.\n\n805\n00:38:48.845 --> 00:38:53.685\nAnd so that, it's changed my workflow\n\n806\n00:38:53.685 --> 00:38:56.165\nin such a tremendous way.\n\n807\n00:38:56.165 --> 00:39:00.325\nI probably spend the most time on Claude.\n\n808\n00:39:00.325 --> 00:39:05.325\nThere's some other AI tools like Manus\n\n809\n00:39:05.325 --> 00:39:09.245\nwhich I also find the capabilities of presentation,\n\n810\n00:39:09.245 --> 00:39:12.565\ncreation and so forth to be exceptional.\n\n811\n00:39:12.565 --> 00:39:17.565\nNotebook LM also with taking big streams of data\n\n812\n00:39:17.565 --> 00:39:22.405\nand it has the ability to turn, you know,\n\n813\n00:39:22.405 --> 00:39:25.885\nbig forms of data into a podcast\n\n814\n00:39:25.885 --> 00:39:28.805\nthat you can listen to in an interesting format.\n\n815\n00:39:28.805 --> 00:39:30.325\nI like that function.\n\n816\n00:39:30.325 --> 00:39:31.365\n- Yeah, fantastic.\n\n817\n00:39:31.365 --> 00:39:34.245\nAnd, you know, broadly speaking,\n\n818\n00:39:34.245 --> 00:39:36.245\nwhen you look at yourself, Demon,\n\n819\n00:39:36.245 --> 00:39:40.485\nwhat are you actively trying to get better at as a leader?\n\n820\n00:39:40.485 --> 00:39:43.925\nAnd how are you trying to sharpen your acts?\n\n821\n00:39:43.925 --> 00:39:48.925\n- Having an understanding of everyone's capabilities,\n\n822\n00:39:48.925 --> 00:39:56.325\nand, you know, you've seen,\n\n823\n00:39:56.325 --> 00:39:59.205\nand I'm not comparing myself to Michael Jordan\n\n824\n00:39:59.205 --> 00:40:01.285\nor Kobe Bryant, but I guess I am\n\n825\n00:40:01.285 --> 00:40:02.805\nnow that I've started on this road,\n\n826\n00:40:02.805 --> 00:40:07.805\nbut you see them and it's hard to be a great coach\n\n827\n00:40:07.805 --> 00:40:13.885\nwhen you played the game really, really well,\n\n828\n00:40:13.885 --> 00:40:15.525\nyou know, better than average.\n\n829\n00:40:15.525 --> 00:40:20.525\nAnd I see really talented individual investors,\n\n830\n00:40:20.525 --> 00:40:25.925\noftentimes don't translate into being a great, you know,\n\n831\n00:40:25.925 --> 00:40:28.885\nCEO or chairman or something.\n\n832\n00:40:28.885 --> 00:40:31.165\nAnd I never want to be in that position\n\n833\n00:40:31.165 --> 00:40:33.205\nbecause I'm not patient enough\n\n834\n00:40:33.205 --> 00:40:36.645\nwith all the different levels of the organization.\n\n835\n00:40:36.645 --> 00:40:41.645\nAnd so the humility of that I'm constantly working on.\n\n836\n00:40:41.645 --> 00:40:44.045\n- Yeah, how do you, you mentioned,\n\n837\n00:40:44.045 --> 00:40:45.365\nyou know, people come in your office,\n\n838\n00:40:45.365 --> 00:40:47.285\nthey got to be prepared, you know,\n\n839\n00:40:47.285 --> 00:40:48.725\nyou'll tell them what you think.\n\n840\n00:40:48.725 --> 00:40:51.325\nAnd, you know, how do you navigate\n\n841\n00:40:51.325 --> 00:40:53.165\nthat need to be more patient?\n\n842\n00:40:53.165 --> 00:40:56.005\nYou know, is there anything you do to tell yourself\n\n843\n00:40:56.005 --> 00:40:59.965\nthat this is, you know, I got a work on being that coach, you know.\n\n844\n00:40:59.965 --> 00:41:04.965\n- The two words that I try to keep in mind\n\n845\n00:41:04.965 --> 00:41:08.445\nwith every interaction that I have,\n\n846\n00:41:08.445 --> 00:41:13.165\neven someone who is rude is dignity and respect.\n\n847\n00:41:13.165 --> 00:41:15.845\nLike treat people with dignity and respect.\n\n848\n00:41:15.845 --> 00:41:17.565\nI learned that from my grandmother.\n\n849\n00:41:17.565 --> 00:41:19.605\nIf I keep that in mind,\n\n850\n00:41:19.605 --> 00:41:21.725\neven if I have to give someone, you know,\n\n851\n00:41:21.725 --> 00:41:24.485\nsome very hard and direct feedback,\n\n852\n00:41:24.485 --> 00:41:27.925\nI'm doing so with dignity and respect.\n\n853\n00:41:27.925 --> 00:41:30.685\n- How does this idea of friends with the good\n\n854\n00:41:30.685 --> 00:41:33.605\nshow up in the way how you lead every day?\n\n855\n00:41:33.605 --> 00:41:36.725\n- Well, one, you know, well with all\n\n856\n00:41:36.725 --> 00:41:41.725\nis me being a friend of the good to society, you know.\n\n857\n00:41:41.725 --> 00:41:47.125\nBut I think one of the principal characteristics\n\n858\n00:41:47.125 --> 00:41:51.405\nof a friend of the good is that they show up.\n\n859\n00:41:51.405 --> 00:41:56.365\nAnd so as I run this company,\n\n860\n00:41:56.365 --> 00:41:58.685\nthe people that work with me know,\n\n861\n00:41:58.685 --> 00:42:00.165\nI'm gonna show up for them.\n\n862\n00:42:00.165 --> 00:42:03.805\nI'm gonna show up for them in terms of what I do at work.\n\n863\n00:42:03.805 --> 00:42:07.405\nBut even if they're dealing with something personally,\n\n864\n00:42:07.405 --> 00:42:08.925\nI'm gonna show up, you know,\n\n865\n00:42:08.925 --> 00:42:11.885\nand that's what a friend of the good does.\n\n866\n00:42:11.885 --> 00:42:13.165\n- Devine, this has been a lot of fun.\n\n867\n00:42:13.165 --> 00:42:16.005\nAnd I wanna have some more of my lightning round of questions.\n\n868\n00:42:16.005 --> 00:42:17.205\nSo are you ready for this?\n\n869\n00:42:17.205 --> 00:42:18.045\n- Let's go.\n\n870\n00:42:18.045 --> 00:42:21.365\n- The three words your team would say best described\n\n871\n00:42:21.365 --> 00:42:25.405\nyou, vision, funny, fast.\n\n872\n00:42:25.405 --> 00:42:27.445\nIf you could be one person for a day,\n\n873\n00:42:27.445 --> 00:42:30.325\nbesides yourself, who would it be?\n\n874\n00:42:30.325 --> 00:42:31.245\n- Michael Jordan.\n\n875\n00:42:31.245 --> 00:42:33.125\n- Your biggest pet peeve.\n\n876\n00:42:33.125 --> 00:42:34.525\n- Not being prepared.\n\n877\n00:42:34.525 --> 00:42:36.445\n- Who would play you in a movie?\n\n878\n00:42:36.445 --> 00:42:37.925\n- Michael B. Jordan.\n\n879\n00:42:37.925 --> 00:42:40.485\n- What's a habit you have that's been absolutely\n\n880\n00:42:40.485 --> 00:42:43.045\ninstrumental to the success that you've had?\n\n881\n00:42:43.045 --> 00:42:44.485\n- Getting shit done.\n\n882\n00:42:44.485 --> 00:42:48.685\n- A leader that everyone should study.\n\n883\n00:42:48.685 --> 00:42:50.365\n- President Obama.\n\n884\n00:42:50.365 --> 00:42:52.965\n- What's something you've been curious about lately\n\n885\n00:42:52.965 --> 00:42:55.925\nthat has absolutely nothing to do with work?\n\n886\n00:42:55.925 --> 00:42:58.605\n- Why my golf game is so bad?\n\n887\n00:42:58.605 --> 00:43:03.845\n- The one thing that you do just for you.\n\n888\n00:43:03.845 --> 00:43:04.885\n- Play golf.\n\n889\n00:43:04.885 --> 00:43:07.005\n- Besides your family and friends,\n\n890\n00:43:07.005 --> 00:43:09.325\nwhat's your most prized possession?\n\n891\n00:43:09.325 --> 00:43:10.445\n- Well with all.\n\n892\n00:43:10.445 --> 00:43:12.405\n- Do you have any collections?\n\n893\n00:43:12.405 --> 00:43:13.245\n- Shoes.\n\n894\n00:43:13.245 --> 00:43:17.605\n- If I turned on the radio in your car,\n\n895\n00:43:17.605 --> 00:43:19.085\nwhat would I hear?\n\n896\n00:43:19.085 --> 00:43:20.165\n- Hip hop.\n\n897\n00:43:20.165 --> 00:43:22.805\n- What's something about you a few people would know?\n\n898\n00:43:22.805 --> 00:43:23.645\n- I'm shy.\n\n899\n00:43:23.645 --> 00:43:26.245\n- Ah, I don't know about that.\n\n900\n00:43:26.245 --> 00:43:28.485\nOkay, what's one of your daily rituals,\n\n901\n00:43:28.485 --> 00:43:30.725\nsomething that you've ever missed?\n\n902\n00:43:30.725 --> 00:43:31.565\n- Prayer.\n\n903\n00:43:31.565 --> 00:43:33.365\n- We're out of the lighting round, great job.\n\n904\n00:43:33.365 --> 00:43:35.405\nOkay, I just got a few more questions,\n\n905\n00:43:35.405 --> 00:43:38.165\nI'll let you get back to making the world better.\n\n906\n00:43:38.165 --> 00:43:40.805\nYou know, I understand that your wife,\n\n907\n00:43:40.805 --> 00:43:44.525\nKia, is one of the great truth tellers in your life.\n\n908\n00:43:44.525 --> 00:43:46.805\nTell me a recent time where she told you something\n\n909\n00:43:46.805 --> 00:43:48.005\nthat no one else would.\n\n910\n00:43:48.885 --> 00:43:53.965\nThere was a deal that I had been working on\n\n911\n00:43:53.965 --> 00:43:58.965\nthat was pretty substantial and she said to me,\n\n912\n00:43:58.965 --> 00:44:04.365\nthey don't deserve you, she's incredible.\n\n913\n00:44:04.365 --> 00:44:06.245\nShe is incredible.\n\n914\n00:44:06.245 --> 00:44:08.725\nLike 28 years of marriage, she is incredible.\n\n915\n00:44:08.725 --> 00:44:10.565\n- Yeah, that's great, yeah.\n\n916\n00:44:10.565 --> 00:44:13.165\n- What have you learned about being a great leader at home?\n\n917\n00:44:13.165 --> 00:44:15.565\n- There is a period of time\n\n918\n00:44:15.565 --> 00:44:20.245\nwhere your kids are going to think that you're an idiot\n\n919\n00:44:20.245 --> 00:44:21.725\nand everybody else is like,\n\n920\n00:44:21.725 --> 00:44:23.685\nyou're pretty smart, but your kids\n\n921\n00:44:23.685 --> 00:44:25.165\nare gonna think that you're an idiot.\n\n922\n00:44:25.165 --> 00:44:26.845\nI'm told that that passes.\n\n923\n00:44:26.845 --> 00:44:31.725\n- I've heard you say that living a life of balance\n\n924\n00:44:31.725 --> 00:44:34.005\nis a false narrative.\n\n925\n00:44:34.005 --> 00:44:35.565\nExplain.\n\n926\n00:44:35.565 --> 00:44:38.605\n- I think this is true in just life and marriage.\n\n927\n00:44:38.605 --> 00:44:41.565\nIn marriage, you know, there's no 50/50,\n\n928\n00:44:41.565 --> 00:44:44.645\nthere's gonna be times where it's 130, negative 30.\n\n929\n00:44:45.645 --> 00:44:50.285\nI think that that's the case, you know, with work as well.\n\n930\n00:44:50.285 --> 00:44:52.845\nAnd having people around you to let you know\n\n931\n00:44:52.845 --> 00:44:56.085\nwhen you're out of balance and my wife, you know,\n\n932\n00:44:56.085 --> 00:45:00.005\nwho definitely does that and is a great barometer,\n\n933\n00:45:00.005 --> 00:45:03.325\nit's super important to get yourself back in balance.\n\n934\n00:45:03.325 --> 00:45:07.605\nBut in order to start a company, to, you know,\n\n935\n00:45:07.605 --> 00:45:09.845\nbe excellent at being an investor,\n\n936\n00:45:09.845 --> 00:45:12.965\nto build a project, there's gonna be moments\n\n937\n00:45:12.965 --> 00:45:16.005\nwhere you have to be out of balance,\n\n938\n00:45:16.005 --> 00:45:18.805\nbut, you know, trying to do a great job, you know,\n\n939\n00:45:18.805 --> 00:45:22.485\nof bringing that balance back is the key.\n\n940\n00:45:22.485 --> 00:45:27.125\nAnd having mechanisms to do that is incredibly important.\n\n941\n00:45:27.125 --> 00:45:28.405\n- When you think about your life\n\n942\n00:45:28.405 --> 00:45:30.725\nand everything you've accomplished already,\n\n943\n00:45:30.725 --> 00:45:34.605\nwhich is extremely impressive, you know,\n\n944\n00:45:34.605 --> 00:45:38.325\nwhat do you see now, DeMond, is your unfinished business?\n\n945\n00:45:39.205 --> 00:45:42.965\n- The unfinished business is to do this work\n\n946\n00:45:42.965 --> 00:45:47.365\nwith Well With All, to close these life expectancy gaps\n\n947\n00:45:47.365 --> 00:45:52.365\nand to set an example, another example,\n\n948\n00:45:52.365 --> 00:45:56.925\nof how the power of business, the power of capitalism\n\n949\n00:45:56.925 --> 00:46:00.485\ncan actually be used for good in a way\n\n950\n00:46:00.485 --> 00:46:01.965\nthat also creates value.\n\n951\n00:46:01.965 --> 00:46:04.725\nLike, I think that that's principally\n\n952\n00:46:06.125 --> 00:46:09.485\nunfinished business from a business standpoint.\n\n953\n00:46:09.485 --> 00:46:12.805\nI also think that there's an opportunity\n\n954\n00:46:12.805 --> 00:46:19.005\nto invest in young men and women across this country,\n\n955\n00:46:19.005 --> 00:46:23.885\nnot only, you know, from a financial resource standpoint,\n\n956\n00:46:23.885 --> 00:46:28.805\nbut also to help with the next generation of philanthropy\n\n957\n00:46:28.805 --> 00:46:33.485\nis something that I'm deeply rooted in.\n\n958\n00:46:33.485 --> 00:46:38.205\nAnd I think most importantly, how, you know,\n\n959\n00:46:38.205 --> 00:46:42.845\nI love and spend time with my family\n\n960\n00:46:42.845 --> 00:46:47.845\nand friends is a critical aspect of the unfinished business.\n\n961\n00:46:47.845 --> 00:46:50.565\n- Fantastic, and last question here,\n\n962\n00:46:50.565 --> 00:46:53.525\nwhat's one piece of advice you'd give to anyone\n\n963\n00:46:53.525 --> 00:46:55.365\nwho wants to be a better leader?\n\n964\n00:46:55.365 --> 00:47:01.525\n- Invest in people, give, give till it hurts.\n\n965\n00:47:01.525 --> 00:47:05.045\nThere's so many people that want to hoard information,\n\n966\n00:47:05.045 --> 00:47:10.045\nthat want to hoard money, that want to be the shining star\n\n967\n00:47:10.045 --> 00:47:14.845\nand the spotlight, just give.\n\n968\n00:47:14.845 --> 00:47:15.685\n- I love that.\n\n969\n00:47:15.685 --> 00:47:18.245\nI think I might put give till it hurts on my refrigerator,\n\n970\n00:47:18.245 --> 00:47:19.765\ntake a look at it again.\n\n971\n00:47:19.765 --> 00:47:21.925\n(laughing)\n\n972\n00:47:21.925 --> 00:47:24.485\nThat's an inspiring way to think about life.\n\n973\n00:47:24.485 --> 00:47:27.245\nAnd you're an inspiring guy, Damana.\n\n974\n00:47:27.245 --> 00:47:28.445\nAnd I want to thank you very much\n\n975\n00:47:28.445 --> 00:47:30.525\nfor taking the time to be on this podcast\n\n976\n00:47:30.525 --> 00:47:32.125\nand show your insights with me.\n\n977\n00:47:32.125 --> 00:47:35.845\nAnd a lot of other people, they're going to get a lot out of it.\n\n978\n00:47:35.845 --> 00:47:39.605\nAnd, you know, humanity is something that's very important.\n\n979\n00:47:39.605 --> 00:47:42.925\nIt's obvious to me that you modeled that\n\n980\n00:47:42.925 --> 00:47:44.245\nfor everyone that you touched.\n\n981\n00:47:44.245 --> 00:47:45.765\nSo thank you very much.\n\n982\n00:47:45.765 --> 00:47:48.125\n- Thank you so much, real honor and pleasure\n\n983\n00:47:48.125 --> 00:47:50.445\nto be with you and thank you for all you do.\n\n984\n00:47:50.445 --> 00:47:58.805\n- Well, David, not only am I going to go by a case\n\n985\n00:47:58.805 --> 00:48:01.805\nof that well with all energy drink after that conversation,\n\n986\n00:48:01.805 --> 00:48:04.685\nI feel like I just want to go out and serve my neighbors.\n\n987\n00:48:04.685 --> 00:48:07.685\nI mean, Damana is such an inspiring leader\n\n988\n00:48:07.685 --> 00:48:09.645\nand has such an inspiring story.\n\n989\n00:48:09.645 --> 00:48:10.725\n- Oh, yeah, absolutely.\n\n990\n00:48:10.725 --> 00:48:14.805\nI love his whole focus on humanity and being human.\n\n991\n00:48:14.805 --> 00:48:18.365\nAnd it's very clear that he walks the talk.\n\n992\n00:48:18.365 --> 00:48:20.245\n- Absolutely, absolutely.\n\n993\n00:48:20.245 --> 00:48:22.325\nWell, David, as we do at the end of every episode,\n\n994\n00:48:22.325 --> 00:48:24.725\nI want to get your take on some of the main themes\n\n995\n00:48:24.725 --> 00:48:26.285\nthat I pulled from this conversation\n\n996\n00:48:26.285 --> 00:48:28.045\nso that we can offer our listeners\n\n997\n00:48:28.045 --> 00:48:30.365\nsomething really practical that they can apply\n\n998\n00:48:30.365 --> 00:48:32.005\nto their leadership and to their life\n\n999\n00:48:32.005 --> 00:48:34.445\nas they go on from this conversation\n\n1000\n00:48:34.445 --> 00:48:36.005\nand back into their lives.\n\n1001\n00:48:36.005 --> 00:48:38.765\nAnd the first theme that really stood out to me\n\n1002\n00:48:38.765 --> 00:48:41.565\nis this idea of relationships\n\n1003\n00:48:41.565 --> 00:48:43.445\nand being a friend of the good.\n\n1004\n00:48:43.445 --> 00:48:45.365\nYou guys talk a little bit about his book\n\n1005\n00:48:45.365 --> 00:48:47.805\nin the conversation.\n\n1006\n00:48:47.805 --> 00:48:51.525\nBut what I really glean from Damana is that, you know,\n\n1007\n00:48:51.525 --> 00:48:56.525\nrelationships really can affect the outcomes that happen\n\n1008\n00:48:56.565 --> 00:48:58.965\nin your life and he is just laser focused\n\n1009\n00:48:58.965 --> 00:49:01.005\non being this friend of the good.\n\n1010\n00:49:01.005 --> 00:49:02.605\nWhat was her take on that?\n\n1011\n00:49:02.605 --> 00:49:07.605\n- I think that, you know, it goes back to his belief\n\n1012\n00:49:07.605 --> 00:49:10.765\nand the importance of humanity.\n\n1013\n00:49:10.765 --> 00:49:13.005\nWhen you think about friends of the good,\n\n1014\n00:49:13.005 --> 00:49:16.405\nthat they're the people that really believe in you,\n\n1015\n00:49:16.405 --> 00:49:18.565\ncare about you, want to invest in you.\n\n1016\n00:49:18.565 --> 00:49:21.925\nAnd it goes both ways.\n\n1017\n00:49:21.925 --> 00:49:25.725\nAnd, you know, they're focused on growing each other.\n\n1018\n00:49:25.725 --> 00:49:29.805\nAnd those are the people you really want to surround yourself\n\n1019\n00:49:29.805 --> 00:49:30.645\nin life.\n\n1020\n00:49:30.645 --> 00:49:34.045\nAnd when you do, you get the ultimate win-win.\n\n1021\n00:49:34.045 --> 00:49:36.845\nYou know, the one plus one truly equals three.\n\n1022\n00:49:36.845 --> 00:49:41.285\nAnd that's that focus that he has on that\n\n1023\n00:49:41.285 --> 00:49:45.365\nis driven, you know, how he assesses people,\n\n1024\n00:49:45.365 --> 00:49:48.805\ntries to build friends with people,\n\n1025\n00:49:48.805 --> 00:49:50.965\nyou know, how he looks at life.\n\n1026\n00:49:50.965 --> 00:49:52.685\nAnd, you know, it's pretty clear\n\n1027\n00:49:52.685 --> 00:49:55.245\nthat he wants to make the world a better place.\n\n1028\n00:49:55.245 --> 00:49:56.805\n- Absolutely, you know, it was interesting\n\n1029\n00:49:56.805 --> 00:49:58.885\nas he was talking about being a friend of the good, you know,\n\n1030\n00:49:58.885 --> 00:50:01.085\nthat kind of carries with it a connotation\n\n1031\n00:50:01.085 --> 00:50:02.405\nthat like everything is good.\n\n1032\n00:50:02.405 --> 00:50:04.325\nBut, I mean, Damana's a truth teller.\n\n1033\n00:50:04.325 --> 00:50:06.805\nSo he is not a guy who skirts around\n\n1034\n00:50:06.805 --> 00:50:08.605\nthe hard truths that need to be spoken.\n\n1035\n00:50:08.605 --> 00:50:12.165\nBut I love how he considers being a truth teller\n\n1036\n00:50:12.165 --> 00:50:15.405\nas a characteristic of being a friend of the good\n\n1037\n00:50:15.405 --> 00:50:17.365\nand just always raising the caliber\n\n1038\n00:50:17.365 --> 00:50:19.965\nand the quality of whatever you're doing.\n\n1039\n00:50:19.965 --> 00:50:23.525\n- Yeah, and I think that that stems from honesty, you know,\n\n1040\n00:50:23.525 --> 00:50:26.685\nwithout honesty and respect,\n\n1041\n00:50:26.685 --> 00:50:30.565\nyou can't give people the dignity that they deserve.\n\n1042\n00:50:30.565 --> 00:50:34.365\nAnd that's a basic that sometimes gets lost.\n\n1043\n00:50:34.365 --> 00:50:37.725\nAnd, you know, what I really like about his approach\n\n1044\n00:50:37.725 --> 00:50:40.525\nis that he just brings it back to the fundamentals\n\n1045\n00:50:40.525 --> 00:50:42.445\nof being a good person.\n\n1046\n00:50:42.445 --> 00:50:43.885\n- Well, speaking of being a good person,\n\n1047\n00:50:43.885 --> 00:50:46.085\nanother one of the main themes\n\n1048\n00:50:46.085 --> 00:50:47.805\nthat I'm taking away from this conversation\n\n1049\n00:50:47.805 --> 00:50:51.765\nis Damana's desire to just make the world better\n\n1050\n00:50:51.765 --> 00:50:54.165\nfor people who are underserved and overlooked.\n\n1051\n00:50:54.165 --> 00:50:57.125\nI mean, he has a real noble cause.\n\n1052\n00:50:57.125 --> 00:50:59.685\nAnd we talk about noble causes a lot on this show\n\n1053\n00:50:59.685 --> 00:51:02.325\nbecause they're important to the success of any business.\n\n1054\n00:51:02.325 --> 00:51:04.285\nBut I want you to break that down a little bit\n\n1055\n00:51:04.285 --> 00:51:06.845\nand talk about what stood out to you so much\n\n1056\n00:51:06.845 --> 00:51:08.645\nabout his noble cause.\n\n1057\n00:51:08.645 --> 00:51:11.125\n- Well, I think what stands out to me\n\n1058\n00:51:11.125 --> 00:51:14.365\nis just the difference that he's trying to make in the world.\n\n1059\n00:51:14.365 --> 00:51:16.685\nAnd, you know, the statistics that he shared\n\n1060\n00:51:16.685 --> 00:51:18.845\nabout the zip code, you can be one zip code away\n\n1061\n00:51:18.845 --> 00:51:21.285\nand have a totally different health dimensions.\n\n1062\n00:51:21.285 --> 00:51:26.285\nAnd, you know, life cycles and suicide rates, et cetera, et cetera.\n\n1063\n00:51:26.285 --> 00:51:29.885\nYou know, and, you know, I think that his noble cause\n\n1064\n00:51:29.885 --> 00:51:34.885\nis one that makes you want to wake up and go attack it.\n\n1065\n00:51:34.885 --> 00:51:38.165\nI mean, it's like he said it's a life purpose for him.\n\n1066\n00:51:38.165 --> 00:51:41.645\nAnd I think that people want to work for people\n\n1067\n00:51:41.645 --> 00:51:46.365\nand in companies where it's more than just making a buck.\n\n1068\n00:51:46.365 --> 00:51:50.925\nYou want to do something that makes society better.\n\n1069\n00:51:50.925 --> 00:51:54.085\nAnd I think every leader should look at what they do\n\n1070\n00:51:54.085 --> 00:51:57.445\nand figure out what you're doing in the world\n\n1071\n00:51:57.445 --> 00:52:00.125\nto make society better\n\n1072\n00:52:00.125 --> 00:52:05.125\nand to bring happiness and fun and excitement\n\n1073\n00:52:05.125 --> 00:52:10.965\nand health or you pick it into people's lives.\n\n1074\n00:52:10.965 --> 00:52:13.925\n- I love when he tells the story about that scary moment\n\n1075\n00:52:13.925 --> 00:52:15.005\nthat he had with his son\n\n1076\n00:52:15.005 --> 00:52:17.365\nand how that was really the flagship moment\n\n1077\n00:52:17.365 --> 00:52:20.725\nwhen he decided to dedicate his life to health equity.\n\n1078\n00:52:20.725 --> 00:52:25.725\nAnd I love that he took that hardship for his family\n\n1079\n00:52:25.725 --> 00:52:28.965\nand really turned it into purpose.\n\n1080\n00:52:28.965 --> 00:52:31.485\nAnd he has this sort of redemptive perspective\n\n1081\n00:52:31.485 --> 00:52:35.405\non hardship and challenges that is fueling\n\n1082\n00:52:35.405 --> 00:52:37.965\nthat noble cause it seems.\n\n1083\n00:52:37.965 --> 00:52:40.005\n- Well, I think a lot of times, you know,\n\n1084\n00:52:40.005 --> 00:52:45.005\nyou make change, you know, every decision is based on pain\n\n1085\n00:52:45.005 --> 00:52:47.485\nand pleasure, you know.\n\n1086\n00:52:47.485 --> 00:52:51.485\nAnd boy, when you have a lot of pain,\n\n1087\n00:52:51.485 --> 00:52:53.885\nyou know, that's going to drive a lot of your decisions.\n\n1088\n00:52:53.885 --> 00:52:58.005\nAnd the pleasure is getting rid of that pain.\n\n1089\n00:52:58.005 --> 00:53:03.005\nAnd I think that's what has him juiced up every day\n\n1090\n00:53:03.005 --> 00:53:06.565\nto go out there and really make a difference.\n\n1091\n00:53:06.565 --> 00:53:07.725\n- Well, the final theme, David,\n\n1092\n00:53:07.725 --> 00:53:08.845\nthat I want to get your take on,\n\n1093\n00:53:08.845 --> 00:53:11.925\nand this is really kind of how I am going to categorize\n\n1094\n00:53:11.925 --> 00:53:12.965\nto mom in my brain.\n\n1095\n00:53:12.965 --> 00:53:15.925\nHe is a guy who gives until it hurts.\n\n1096\n00:53:15.925 --> 00:53:17.165\nAnd he talks a bit about that\n\n1097\n00:53:17.165 --> 00:53:19.205\nin the episode, and I just love that.\n\n1098\n00:53:19.205 --> 00:53:22.005\nTalk a little bit more about how that landed with you.\n\n1099\n00:53:22.005 --> 00:53:24.165\n- I think his company is based on that.\n\n1100\n00:53:24.165 --> 00:53:29.165\nYou know, it's like 20% of the profits go to, you know,\n\n1101\n00:53:29.165 --> 00:53:32.485\nhealth equity and really making a difference\n\n1102\n00:53:32.485 --> 00:53:35.085\nand changing the dynamics of the zip codes\n\n1103\n00:53:35.085 --> 00:53:36.845\nthat we just talked about.\n\n1104\n00:53:36.845 --> 00:53:41.845\nBut he feels that way in terms of how you work with people.\n\n1105\n00:53:41.845 --> 00:53:45.925\nAnd if they know that you are committed to them\n\n1106\n00:53:45.925 --> 00:53:47.685\nand that you're going to give to them,\n\n1107\n00:53:47.685 --> 00:53:49.405\nhe said it comes back to you.\n\n1108\n00:53:49.405 --> 00:53:51.365\nIt's more like the more you give,\n\n1109\n00:53:51.365 --> 00:53:53.765\nthe more you receive, it is so, so true.\n\n1110\n00:53:53.765 --> 00:53:57.445\nSo his whole belief is I'm going to believe in giving\n\n1111\n00:53:57.445 --> 00:53:59.165\nbecause if I know I give,\n\n1112\n00:53:59.165 --> 00:54:01.165\nI'm going to be doing the right thing for the world.\n\n1113\n00:54:01.165 --> 00:54:04.885\nAnd I'm also going to get the joy of having it come back to me.\n\n1114\n00:54:04.885 --> 00:54:08.205\nAnd, you know, I think that's why he's a pretty happy guy.\n\n1115\n00:54:08.205 --> 00:54:10.765\nYou know, one of the things that really struck out to me\n\n1116\n00:54:10.765 --> 00:54:12.285\nwas just his demeanor.\n\n1117\n00:54:12.285 --> 00:54:16.125\nI mean, he's very even keel, thoughtful,\n\n1118\n00:54:16.125 --> 00:54:18.285\nand had a huge smile.\n\n1119\n00:54:18.285 --> 00:54:21.125\nAnd, you know, and he thinks he's funny\n\n1120\n00:54:21.125 --> 00:54:24.045\nand I'm sure he is, but, you know,\n\n1121\n00:54:24.045 --> 00:54:26.845\nI think he's a guy that's benefiting from giving.\n\n1122\n00:54:26.845 --> 00:54:29.005\nAnd when you can do that, that's awesome.\n\n1123\n00:54:29.005 --> 00:54:32.605\nAnd he truly is a special person.\n\n1124\n00:54:32.605 --> 00:54:33.445\n- He is.\n\n1125\n00:54:33.445 --> 00:54:34.605\nWell, David, as we wrap this conversation,\n\n1126\n00:54:34.605 --> 00:54:36.965\nwhat do you really want our listeners to walk away\n\n1127\n00:54:36.965 --> 00:54:40.165\nthinking about applying to their lives and to their leadership?\n\n1128\n00:54:40.165 --> 00:54:42.725\n- I would say, man, there's some real win-wins out there.\n\n1129\n00:54:42.725 --> 00:54:46.045\nYou know, you know, surround yourself with friends of the goods,\n\n1130\n00:54:46.045 --> 00:54:48.845\npeople that are going to invest in you, you invest in them,\n\n1131\n00:54:48.845 --> 00:54:52.005\npeople are caring you, people that you care about them.\n\n1132\n00:54:52.005 --> 00:54:54.325\nYou know, it comes back to you in every way.\n\n1133\n00:54:54.325 --> 00:54:57.765\nYou know, whatever you can do in your business\n\n1134\n00:54:57.765 --> 00:55:00.925\nto really identify the noble cause, you know,\n\n1135\n00:55:00.925 --> 00:55:05.925\nWalmart's was to make great brands affordable\n\n1136\n00:55:05.925 --> 00:55:08.205\nto ordinary folks, you know,\n\n1137\n00:55:08.205 --> 00:55:11.405\nhis is to, you know, close the gap on the zip code problem,\n\n1138\n00:55:11.405 --> 00:55:13.445\nyou know, that we talked about.\n\n1139\n00:55:13.445 --> 00:55:17.805\nYeah, but find that noble cause and share it with your people\n\n1140\n00:55:17.805 --> 00:55:21.005\nand that's going to get people more fired up to come to work\n\n1141\n00:55:21.005 --> 00:55:22.685\nthan just making a dollar.\n\n1142\n00:55:22.685 --> 00:55:26.765\nAnd last but not least, you know, give televerts, you know,\n\n1143\n00:55:26.765 --> 00:55:29.885\nbe the first to give, not the first to take.\n\n1144\n00:55:29.885 --> 00:55:32.645\nAnd, you know, you'll see that it's very rewarding\n\n1145\n00:55:32.645 --> 00:55:35.005\nand enriching and, you know,\n\n1146\n00:55:35.005 --> 00:55:37.485\nwe all know countless people who do that.\n\n1147\n00:55:37.485 --> 00:55:39.245\nAnd we all admire them, right?\n\n1148\n00:55:39.245 --> 00:55:40.445\nWe admire the givers.\n\n1149\n00:55:40.445 --> 00:55:42.405\nWe don't really admire the takers.\n\n1150\n00:55:42.405 --> 00:55:44.485\n- Well, David, thanks so much for another episode\n\n1151\n00:55:44.485 --> 00:55:45.405\nof \"How leaders lead.\"\n\n1152\n00:55:45.405 --> 00:55:47.485\nThanks to DeMann Martin for spending some time\n\n1153\n00:55:47.485 --> 00:55:48.325\non the show today.\n\n1154\n00:55:48.325 --> 00:55:51.765\nAnd thank you, as always, to our listeners\n\n1155\n00:55:51.765 --> 00:55:54.925\nfor tuning in to another episode of \"How leaders lead.\"\n\n1156\n00:55:54.925 --> 00:55:56.205\nWe'll see you next week.\n","is_pinned",false,"pinned_at","is_featured","featured_at","mix_url","https://chtbl.com/track/DCB44F/traffic.megaphone.fm/DVL3220049897.mp3","dx_media_id",4405,"video_media_id","thumbnail_image_media_id","published_date","2026-09-24","itunes_episode_id",310,"youtube_id","OLms76lKc2A","2026-09-24T19:29:04.000000Z","Listen to this leadership podcast with Demond Martin, Cofounder & CEO of WellWithAll, and discover the people-first philosophy that can change the way you look at 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